Feedback for Tan Sri Muhyiddin on Chinese view of MCA

Julai 20, 2012 at 1:52 am 56 comments

It was reported last Sunday that Muhyiddin Yassin had fingered MCA for failing to understand the sentiments of the Chinese.

The BN deputy chairman is right. MCA has lost the plot.

Muhyiddin was quoted as questioning:

“Are the Chinese really that complicated? Can their attitudes not be comprehended?”

The problem is not that Chinese are either complicated or too difficult to understand but rather MCA changed its direction post-2008. Now the party is beginning to talk and behave as if it’s a DAP clone.

Take this immediate response by MCA deputy president Liow Tiong Lai.

According to Oriental Daily (via Malaysian Digest), Liow replied:

“In my opinion, the deputy prime minister must understand the voice of all Malaysians and not just listen to Malays.”

“He cannot just look after the needs of the Malays, but must look after the needs of all Malaysians. If he understood that, he would not have made those comments.”

Liow Tiong Lai’s words sound like they came from Lim Guan Eng’s mouth.

It is a mistake for MCA to try to outDAP the DAP.

Liow’s statement strays into the Guan Eng blame-game terrain. Instead of setting its own terms of engagement, MCA is wading into DAP territory defined by confrontation, incessant negativity and a nothing-is-negotiable approach.

MCA becoming Christianized too?

Since Tan Sri Muhyiddin is a Johorean, he may recall a seminar not too long ago co-organized by the state education department together with the Johor Mufti office on helping teachers address the “threat of Christianization” among their students.

It is not only Malays who are experiencing discomfort at the evangelists’ increasing foray and takeover of public space. Some Buddhist Chinese and the Hindu Indians feel the same.

The Tan Sri is correct to chide the MCA for losing touch with Chinese sentiments because the MCA seems to be only catering to the demography residing in Damansara Utama and attending the Methodist Church (DUMC) or the Subang Jaya middle-class attending the City Harvest Church.

Speaking for myself as a Chinese living on the edge of a New Village, and as a one brought up in a Buddhist household, and whose parents spoke Chinese at home, and was not myself conversant with the English language as a child, I wish to inform Tan Sri Muhyiddin that indeed the MCA of today alienates.

This feeling of disconnect is compounded by The Star‘s promotion of the Anglophile-Christian worldview.

It is to my dismay that I see MCA succumbing to the “if you can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” credo. Since MCA is not abreast of DAP in determining the tenor of the public narrative, it then decides to jump too on the Malaysian First bandwagon propelled by the Anglophile and Christian twin engines.

MCA fails to influence public opinion

Monogamy is a Christian tradition.

The hail of stones being cast at Dr Chua Soi Lek for adultery – not only by DAP followers but by their party leaders themselves such as Lim Guan Eng, who twice invoked Dr Chua’s “pornographic video” in recent press statements, and by Guan Eng’s understudy Hannah Yeoh at the party annual confab 2012 - illustrates that it is DAP which is in control of the public mood and censorious tone.

Castigating sin is a major preoccupation of the Christians. Buddhist Chinese are not similarly obsessed with branding other people sinful or wicked and destining them to hell (a place reserved for BN supporters).

It’s already been 5 years since Dr Chua’s video was leaked. Refusal to let go of the episode is sheer vindictiveness and flagellation.

Why is it that the Christians are commanding the bully pulpit to continue making an issue out of Dr Chua’s escapade when non-Christians like me much prefer that the holier-than-thou taunters keep their self-righteousness to themselves?

There are many more numbers of Chinese who are not Christians yet the Christians are such a loud, aggressive and influential minority that in the preceding sentence, I’ve had to frame those who do not taunt Dr Chua as “non-Christians”.

The default label in a binary always refers the stronger of the pair, e.g. the question is typically asked: How tall are you? Five foot two … not ‘How short are you?

The default for Malaysians viz. religious affiliation is Muslim and the other half of the binary, ‘non-Muslim’. The default term for Chinese Malaysians has now apparently become ‘Christians’ and its complement, non-Christians.

That this minority dominance has happened in recent years implies that the MCA-BN consociationalism model has lost out to the DAP Christian religious thrust. (A parallel example is the PAS political Islam vocabulary vs the Umno Malay nationalist idiom).

MCA, which has ‘Chinese’ in its party name, should be the one the embodying the Chinese soul like how Umno projects itself as guardian of the Malay spirit.

It is evident MCA has failed to represent Chinese sentiments. It is DAP that is today defining the Chinese.

MCA can’t even control its paper

Two months back, The Star-National Union of Journalists (NUJ) chairman publicly tweeted his ridicule of the MCA bevy of ministers. He even alluded to Rosmah Mansor as “Oi Big Mama” in his Twitter conversation with a DAP assemblyman.

And the mockery does not come from him alone but other of the paper’s reporters as well. The undercurrent of contempt that The Star holds for BN did not escape the notice of regular readers of this blog whom have called it “The Rocket‘s sister publication” and a “Fifth Column“.

BN should be very worried if The Star’s behaviour is reflective of its owner the MCA.

In which case, the question to fret BN is this — Will MCA allow its overiding profit-motive to sabotage the BN election campaign?

Just see how money-minded The Star is.

On the day of Dr Chua’s 2.0 debate, The Star had splashed over several pages (including front page and editorial) many articles on the rape of Penang hills by developers.

Yet in the week immediately following, it raked in the revenue from a big Star Property Fair hosted for the very same developers. The Star wished to have its cake and to eat it too.

MCA is behaving in a similar Profit-seeking First way. It wants to be given seats to contest but not pulling its weight. The media is part of any election machinery but the MCA paper cannot be relied on by BN.

The ‘Allah’ controversy is one example how The Star failed Umno.

Western media painted a picture that the Muslims were bullying the Christians over the ‘Allah’ contestation. The other side of the story, which is that the Muslims were responding to a situation rather than being the ones to initiate the conflict, was left untold in The Star‘s main narrative.

Foreign correspondents covering the Allah story were largely Westeners who do not read the Chinese, Tamil or Malay local press.

Thus they would only have gotten some of their ideas and impressions of the unfolding situation from English media, one of them The Star.

Another example of shaping public perception is that Malays are depicted as being irrationally apprehensive of Christians due to the Umno power craziness.

In reality there are Chinese like me, and there are my Indian Hindu friends who are uncomfortable as well with the evangelist trend. So how come English media portrays the scenario as if it is only the Malay-Muslims who are over-reacting to a fear of Christians after being brainwashed by Umno?

Why hasn’t The Star gotten the message across that it takes two hands to clap, and if there is a collision course with the Malay-Muslim polity, it’s also because the Christian bullet train is hurtling from the opposite direction?

Despite the MCA’s jeopardy, its own paper is still continuing with their unabashed promotion of the DAP personality cult as well as giving undue prominence to biased views slanted to favour the evangelical Christians.

Tan Sri Muhyiddin is right to demand that the MCA shape up.

However, it remains hard for me to be convinced that MCA will be able to get its act together unless the party is first willing to rein in its internal saboteur The Star.

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56 Komen Add your own

  • 1. NadZree  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 7:59 am

    GUNTING yang bertopeng sudah mula menunjukkan rupa sebenar mereka….sudah saya jangkakan semangkin hampir ke pilihanraya maka maka ‘manusia manusia’ ini akan mula mengeluarkan ‘taring taring’ mereka.

    Secara halus mereka mereka yang dalam kerajaan akan mengeluarkan kenyataan kenyataan yang tidak memberi kebaikan kepada kerajaan hari ini atau kenyataan rakyat.
    Lately I m noticing this trend hard for me to dismiss it….m I Paranoid…I doubt so..

    Adakah mereka mereka ini GUNTING dalam MCA atau MCA itu GUNTING dalam BN atau MCA dah tak wujud hanya DAP ???

    Ini menjadikan mereka ini GUNTING dialam KABINET…..so bangun NAJIB…..banyak ULAR di PUTRAJAYA memanaskan kerusi untuk PR….

    Balas
  • 2. NadZree  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 8:05 am

    Pembetulan

    “Secara halus mereka akan membuat kenyataan yang tidak membawa kebaikan kepada kerajaan, termasuklah keputusan yang mengurangkan popularity kerajaan di kalangan rakyat.”

    Balas
  • 3. shamshul anuar  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 9:00 am

    Helen,

    What Muhyiddin said is in line with what Malays think in general. That MCA takes an easy way out.

    For decades MCA has been enjoying the luxury of being supported by malays and UMNO( due to links wuth UMNO) while at the same time portraying that UMNO is bullying other component parties.

    Due to Malays and UMNO’s attitude of not wanting to create a scene, MCA becomes bolder.It has becomes DAP version of BN.

    MCA was very rude by saying that it lost badly due to ties with UMNO. The reverse is the truth. Had not for UMNO, MCA is likely to be found its way to museum only.

    MCA simply refuses to tell the Chinese that the way forward is alliance with other races especially the Malays. Waging war on every angle on Malays as done by DAP is not the way to follow.

    MCA simply refuses to tell the Chinese that not only chinese has aspirations but malays too. MCA simply does not tell the Chinese that it is not a sin for UMNO to take care of Malay interests. If not UMNO, which party will? DAP?

    Many of my Chinese friends were surprise when I told them Muslims view on name “allah” is not UMNO’s creation. Rather, Malays and Muslims expect UMNO to defend the name from being used by christians as they feel that sharing the name will EVENTUALLY lead to sharing of faith, something that ALLAH SWT does not forgive..

    If I who wields no power at all can make my Chinese friends realise that Muslim has a point, why on earth MCA refuses to try to tell the Chinese how Muslims and malay feel.

    Rather, MCA seems oblivious to this issue, and this makes UMNO looks very bad.

    No wonder the goodwill has been lost. Nowadays, I heard Malays say they will elect anyone as long as he is a Malay. But MCA is still “senng lenang”. unable to win over Chinese, now MCA upsets the very community that gives the ONLY SUPPORT MCA has.

    Balas
    • 4. Helen Ang  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 9:23 am

      When I “reiterated my contention that the convention of Allah belongs to Islam” in a 28 Jan 2010 Malaysiakini article (see here), the pro-opposition readers mulalah mengamok.

      They refuse to see the point about tauhid and syirik. They also won’t believe that Malay-Muslims are upset about the Allah issue for genuine faith reasons but insist that the Malay reaction is only an Umno plot.

      When a Chinese like me tries to explain, then I’m told that as a non-Christian, it’s none of my business or I get branded as an Umno stooge.

      Through their disinterest in the matter, MCA has allowed The Star to frame the Allah issue in the Christian’s favour.

      The Star has done nothing to influence public opinion to curb the thuggery and widespread fitnah being carried out by DAPsters, even when the targets are Wanita MCA and Beliawanis.

      In fact, when Beliawanis complained that a PKR Adun had “insulted and hurt the feelings of young women in MCA”, The Star indirectly sided with the PKR Adun by not giving Beliawanis any space for their press statement.

      The Beliawanis treasurer who complained that Hannah Yeoh is a “DAP Super Cyberbully” is given zero coverage by The Star this year (Google results).

      Gunting dalam Lipatan!

      Balas
      • 5. shamshul anuar  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 2:46 pm

        Helen,

        MCA may not has the lion share of Chinese vote. But only a moron will keep an editor that openly supports DAP while owning the very same newspaper.

        What these MCA politicians should do is to ensure that the voice of malays be heard when it comes to as an example, the word “allah”. What is so difficult about that. I can do it with my limited resources .

        Balas
      • 6. jonnymalaya  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 4:47 pm

        The word Allah has been in use for hundreds of years in Malay language bibles. Its only within the last 2 or 3 decades some serbanista Taliban wannabes in the kerajaan want to make an issue out of it.

        For your info, roughly 60% of the Christians are Malay-speaking Bumiputras. Those Chinese ones only make up 10%. Malay language bibles cater to those 60%.

        Seriously if Muslims can be easily swayed to convert by the word Allah in the bible, their faith must be really weak and fragile. What next? Converting to Sikhism because they also use ‘Allah’?
        ________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

        So is it the 60% Malay-speaking Bumiputra Christians or the 10% Chinese Christians who making a vocal political issue out of it, and is the Malay response (church fire-bombing & arson) a reaction to the 60% in Sabah/S’wak or to the 10% in Klang Valley? — Helen

        Balas
      • 7. jonnymalaya  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 5:59 pm

        >>>>> So is it the 60% Malay-speaking Bumiputra Christians or the 10% Chinese Christians who making a vocal political issue out of it, and is the Malay response (church fire-bombing & arson) a reaction to the 60% in Sabah/S’wak or to the 10% in Klang Valley? — Helen

        Murphy Pakiam was one of those who challenged the ban on the word in Malay Catholic newsletter:

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titular_Roman_Catholic_Archbishop_of_Kuala_Lumpur_v._Menteri_Dalam_Negeri

        Sidang Injil Borneo, a major Bumiputera church in East Malaysia
        also challenged the ban:

        http://www-random.malaysiakini.com/news/76371

        “”””Sabah SIB president pastor Jerry Dusing filed the suit on Dec 10, 2007, when the import of six school education book titles were banned after the Customs Department seized the consignment of materials on the grounds that the publications contained words exclusive to Islam.

        “”””The words in contention are ‘Allah’ (God), ‘Baitullah’ (House of God), ‘Solat’ (prayer) and ‘Kaabah’ (The Sacred House).

        “”””Apart from the SIB case, there is also another pending case before the Kuala Lumpur High Court, involving the seizure of religious compact discs (CDs) which also use the word ‘Allah’, from Jakarta in 2008 by Sarawakian Jill Ireland Lawrence Bill.

        “”””Jill, who is from the indigenous Melanau tribe, is challenging that seizure, and is seeking a court order for the return of the confiscated CDs.””””

        As for the attacks related to the issue, I would not say it a Malay response. Rather it is more a reaction of extremists.

        Most people in Peninsular Malaysia think Malaysian Christians are either Chinese or Indian, with some Orang Asli, Dusun, Iban, Bajau, et cetera. The opposite is actually the truth.

        I strongly doubt the extremists know this fact. Their actions were directed towards Christians than a specific race of Christians. Majority of churches that were attacked were not Catholic or S.I.B.

        Balas
      • 8. I hate n'sync  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 1:39 am

        I think jonnymalaya is confused. The issue with the use of Allah in the Bible / Kitab Injil is more than just a matter of exclusive use of translations. It is directly related to the fears of proselytization explicitly mentioned in the Constitution of Malaysia.

        The entire episode clearly shows how the system of governance works in this country. The Home Ministry acted beyond its powers to assauge fears of possible proselytization by banning the import of bibles in Bahasa Indonesia. The Sidang Injil Borneo, spreading its good word to the Peninsula, has decided to get this heard in the court according to the letters of the law. SIB got the ruling it needed, but they lost on another larger court of public opinion.

        The incident signified a failure of more diplomatic solutions but at a closer inspection, SIB is not the naive, sincere and inexperienced evangelist most of us imagine. Like the CHC, SIB is well organized and prepared, flushed with funds, and their rise is not only a threat to fellow denominations in the Peninsula, but they are galvanizing the other churches to take a much more activist and confrontative approach to their work in this country (read: the Herald).

        Who wins really?

        Balas
        • 9. Helen Ang  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 1:49 am

          Although the Malay-Muslims did not vocally object in the past, the basic argument remains that Allah is One whereas the Christian Allah is Three, and the Christian usage is a subversion of Islam.

          Secondly the prohibitions have been gazetted since the 1980s just that enforcement was lax, as they are with several other laws (e.g. sodomy).

          Previously, there was accommodation but recently there has been less accommodation. Could this have anything to do with the increased aggression being displayed by the ‘new’ Christians plus that there are more such belligerent Muslims as Zul Nordin who are unlike the Malays of the 1950s and 60s generation?

          Balas
      • 10. I hate n'sync  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 1:58 am

        By the way, to avoid further confusion by the data given by jonny, there are about 1.2 million Other Bumiputera Christians, making up about 50% of the total Other Bumiputeras population (2.4 million) according to the 2000 Census. Almost 10% or 0.5 million Chinese are Christians in the same census out of the total Chinese population (5.4 million).

        This means that 63% of the Christians in this country are Bumiputeras like Idris Jala, and remaining are like Hannah Yeoh and her husband. Total Christian population in Malaysia is about 1.9 million in 2000. I am sure it has grown, but the fact remains that SIB represents a significant competitor to Islamic proselytization in this side of the country. Lets not even talk about converting muslims, the fact that it has made a huge in-road among the Other Bumiputera category is a significant point that must not be overlooked by the religious authorities.

        Considering that both monotheistic religions are as equally fervent and zealous about converting new faithfuls and spreading their gospel / dakwah, we should get used to more of this. Just hope that the 10% Chinese Christians don’t get molokov cocktailed when tensions rise. I mean, mob mentality being what it is, usually the innocent victims get hurt by the actions of some self-appointed leaders (read: Bersih 3).

        Balas
  • 11. Anwar Penipu  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 11:36 am

    tak habis2 filem porno chua soi lek. orang2 pembangkang tak bosan ke ? apa kata kita bincang pulak gambar2 elizabeth wong.

    Balas
  • 12. Joe  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 11:58 am

    Castigating sin is not a Christian preoccupation, in my view. That is the domain of reborn Christians, the ones who feel more christian than JC himself.
    _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

    Your observation explains the pseudonym chosen by our ‘Makin Cuci’ fella? — Helen

    Balas
    • 13. Makin Cuci Makin Kotor  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 3:29 pm

      Makin Cuci Makin Kotor refers to the tagline of one of the DAP’s promotional videos. It features a Malay-looking lady washing her clothes in a washing machine using Brand “BN” detergent. The more she washes the clothes with the Brand “BN” detergent, the dirtier the clothes become. Thus, “Makin Cuci Makin Kotor”. Thanks for allowing me the product placement opportunity, this is a completely relevant reply to your remark, by the way. Also, please note I am in no way a member of any political party nor am I affiliated with any NGO though I did march in Bersih 3.0. The DAP, though not perfect by a long shot, is by far our best hope for a better Malaysia. Salam Bersih.

      Balas
      • 14. gratitude  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 1:55 am

        how can dap get away with such rude videos and slander?

        they talk from high horses.

        they take crude advantage of BN’s give and take attitude in spirit of cooperation and compromise.

        let be reminded that they may be worse. Begining from tailorgate and now developergate. And its only the tip of iceberg

        Balas
      • 15. Joe  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 2:04 am

        DAP in Malaysia follow their name sake in Germany, Deutsche Arbiter Partei.

        I especially pity the people of Penang, who aren’t even allowed to lead their own state. And they have to suffer the stigma of Ketua Umum being a Penangite as well…
        ______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

        S’okay, Ketua Umum is Anugerah Tuhan. — Helen

        Balas
  • 16. pakard  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 12:31 pm

    Salam dek Helen,

    “Are the Chinese really that complicated? Can their attitudes not be comprehended?”

    Soalan yang baik untuk direnung. Pada pandangan Pak Ard, orang Cina “biasa” ni mudah saja, mereka inginkan kehidupan lebih baik, seperti semua rakyat yang lain. Mereka juga perlukan sedikit ruang untuk melakukan apa yang mereka suka dan mengamalkan budaya mereka.

    Sifat “pendatang” masih ada dalam kotak pemikiran mereka, oleh itu sikap berjaga-jaga sentiasa ada, takut di apa-apakan oleh penduduk pribumi. Kerisauan ini membuat mereka lebih percaya kepada perkhabaran tidak rasmi, kerana yang rasmi dianggap dikawal pribumi dan berkemungkinan dimanupulasi.

    UMNO (peribumi dalam konteks semenanjung) berada dalam satu kumpulan yang mempunyai rakan Cina iaitu MCA untuk memain peranan meredakan kerisauan ini. DAP pula di satu pihak yang bertentangan akan sentiasa mepergunakan rasa risau ini ditambah pula dengan gambaran ditindas untuk memperoleh sokongan orang Cina.

    “Bukan Cina” tidak ada di hati DAP. DAP bukan Cina, mereka adalah sekumpulan elit Cina yang tamak yang memerlukan sokongan orang Cina untuk menjayakan cita-cita mereka. Orang Cina bukan DAP, mereka hanya menyokong. Itu pandangan Pak Ard.

    UMNO juga sama, bukan Melayu melihat UMNO itu Melayu, tetapi Melayu ada PAS dan PKR. UMNO juga sekumpulan elit Melayu tamak yang menagih sokongan Melayu. Lalu mereka berebut dengan PKR dan PAS. Pak Ard berada di luar kumpulan elit itu.

    Dalam keadaan sekarang MCA gagal meraih sokongan Cina kerana mereka merisaukan lagi orang Cina lalu lebih lagi menyokong DAP. Apakah mereka sendiri juga ada kerisauan atau sengaja menjana kerisauan kerana MCA juga tamak?

    PM Najib betul dalam memberi bantuan melalui program “1Malaysia”nya. Kumpulan sasar lebih kepada kelompok sosial bukan kaum seperti bantuan kepada golongan miskin, pelajar dan orang tua, pemandu teksi dan sebagainya. Kenapa MCA tidak canangkan ini kepada orang Cina?

    Bahawa kepimpinan Melayu dari kumpulan yang mereka angotai bersedia melihat kesusahan masyarakat dari sudut kelompok sosial bukan ras atau kaum. Orang Melayu tidak membantah, tetapi orang Cina dilihat tidak berterima kasih, ada saja yang tak kena yang dicanangkan oleh DAP dan MCA membisu.

    Orang Melayu memandang, jika berkongsi sebegini masih tidak menambat hati Cina, Apa yang mereka mahu? Adakah mereka mahukan semuanya kepada Cina tanpa berkongsi? Jika begitu, maka orang Melayu akan berpatah arang berkerat rotan mempertahankan Tanah Melayu ini.

    Untuk PRU 13, kita akan memilih, pilihan terhad setakat apa yang ada sekarang, mengharap sesuatu yang baru mungkin mustahil, pilihlah dengan bijak. Sekian.
    _____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

    Apakan daya. Menganggap mesti semua tak kena memang fitrah si DAPster. — Helen

    Balas
    • 17. HuaYong  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 3:21 pm

      “Orang Cina bukan DAP, mereka hanya menyokong”, “UMNO juga sama” pandangan pakard yg rational dan matang.

      Umno bermula dengan ahli ahli yang memang berjuang untuk bangsa dan negara, ini tidak dapat dinafikan, same seperti parti yang lain, cita-cita seumumnya ialah untuk semua dan bukan diri sendiri, tetapi kuasa dan tamak bolen meluputkan hati yang mulia dan bersih, termasuk gua sama lu, itu menyebabkan orang barat yang lebih pengalaman dan fikiran mantap dalam politik mengandai / mengguna demokrasi sebagai satu cara mengatasi kekurangan dan kelemahan manusia.

      Gua guna lumia/wp, bukan iphone atau android, sebab kalu iphone dan android menguasai pasaran, mereka akan jadi sombong dan kurang inovasi, dalam jangka masa panjang, yang ruginya pengguna, gua rasa ini analogi yang sama kita pakai dalam politik, kami sebagai rakyat mesti cekap dan faham dengan taktik keseimbangan, menukar jika perlu dan memupuk pertandingan. Gua rasa ini pendekatan yang terbaik untuk mengawal politikus.

      Balas
  • 18. I hate n'sync  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 1:57 pm

    Doesn’t matter what Liow Tiong Lai says because that man has a rare talent of sinking his own ship by what he says in defence. I mean, from Tong Shin to WWW, you would think LTL would have bought insurance for his foot-in-mouth disease.

    Balas
  • 19. Makin Cuci Makin Kotor  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 1:59 pm

    It is you who has lost the plot, Helen. This post is another train wreck of non-sequiturs.

    Ignoring your ‘catch-all’ headline (‘feedback’ can mean anything, and anything is precisely what your post was), let me summarize your “plot”:

    Section 1:

    First you say MCA has lost its plot since 2008 and illustrate with Liow Tiong Lai supposedly aping the DAP.

    Correlation does not imply causation. Just because Liow talks sense for once it does not mean he’s aping DAP. He could very well have been a sensible person all along, just without the guts to say anything until Muhyddin goaded the MCA with his disparaging remarks.

    Anyway, one swallow doth not a summer make. Please show me (links please) at least one DAP-like statement made by the MCA for every month since January 2008. Please match them issue-for-issue and make sure these DAP-like statements come fast on the heels of the DAP, not some afterthought months after upon getting taunted by UMNO.

    Also, if the MCA has been aping the DAP since 2008, wouldn’t its support among Malaysians of all races also have waxed like the DAP, not waned like MCA? Wouldn’t it be seen to be relevant to the Chinese (at least) and not a zero to everybody but themselves and in danger of being completely wiped out in the GE13?

    Section 2:

    Out jumps your other hobby horse, the English-speaking Christian “evangelical” one. Apparently, the MCA’s lost plot comes from it catering to (presumably Chinese) “evangelical” Christians Anglophiles.

    First, I don’t see how MCA is catering to this demographic. Please provide links and show the how MCA is catering for Chinese + English adoring + Christian “evangelicals”.

    Secondly, I don’t see why they should, since this is a tiny demographic. Christians make up 9% of the Malaysian population. Chinese Christians, let’s be generous, 50% of 9% of the Malaysian population (you say “there are many more numbers of Chinese who are not Christians” so 50% is the absolute maximum I can give you). Add the Anglophile bit, considering Malaysia’s horrendous decline in English and the Brits having lost out to Corporate America long ago, and this probably drops to 25% of that. Add the “evangelical” bit which I have no idea what you mean, so let’s be ultra generous, at 100% of the Christian population. Math, math: 1.13% of the Malaysian population.

    So the MCA is aping the DAP in pandering to 1.13% of the Malaysian population. I can see how brilliant this is. No wonder the DAP is doing so well and the MCA doing so badly, both doing exactly the same thing (presumably, since according to you MCA is aping DAP since 2008).

    I’m being sarcastic here, of course. The fact is the MCA has not been aping the DAP, and only caters for the tiny demographic of tycoons and tycoon-wannabes who think they can sidle up to UMNO for contracts and licences.

    Section 3:

    Here’s where it gets interesting. Apparently, according to you, the fact that the Chinese are abandoning MCA in droves is due to (1) the DAP’s supposed Christian “evangelicals” and their core belief in monogamy and (2) their vindictiveness which (3) it is able to project to the rest of the Chinese population by harping for 5 years on MCA President Chua Soi Lek’s 40 minute-plus complete performance in flagrante delicto in a Johor Bahru hotel room with a woman who was not his wife.

    But wait a minute. Since you said there were more non-Christian Chinese than Christian Chinese, and I’ve already very generously calculated the demographic of Chinese “evangelical” Christian Anglophiles to be 1.13% of the Malaysian population (or, if you like 12.5% of the Malaysian Chinese population, very generously, since there are plenty of Catholics, Methodists, Baptists, Presbyterians, Anglicans, etc. among the Christian Chinese, not just “evangelicals” whatever that may be), the DAP must be preaching to the wrong crowd i.e. the 98.87% of the Malaysian population who are not Chinese “evangelical” Christian Anglophiles (CeCAs) who are presumably Malay, Indian, Dan Lain Lain, Muslims, Taoists, Buddhists, Confucianists, Hindus, Animists, Zoroasterians, atheists, agnostics, evolutionary deists, Shintoists, Methodists, Presbyterians, Lutherans, Baptists, Mormons, Latter-Day Saints, Jehovah Witnesses, … you get the idea.

    This 98.87% of the Malaysian population, who are apparently the opposite of the CeCAs in very core value that matters, don’t harp on sin and and forgive easily (especially of adultery of the mass-produced DVD kind by leaders of political parties claiming to represent a minority race). And yet, somehow, the DAP, by whipping up a crowd 98.87% of whom are completely opposed to its CeCA values, has been able to gain massive support while the MCA (which has been aping the DAP since 2008) has not.

    And, according to you, that’s because the DAP CeCAs are “dominant”. The DAP, supposedly leaders of 1.13% of the population, whose life values are diametrically opposite to the rest of the peace-loving, quick-forgiving, sin-agnostic, adultery-tolerant 98.87% of the population, has been able to gain support just because they’re “dominant”. In other words, they’re dominant because they’re dominant. That explains a lot.

    I put it to that most people, and by that I include the 98.87% of the population who aren’t allegedly CeCA, would be horrified by what Chua Soi Lek did given his position as MCA president, a position of supposed trust. And the fact that it’s available on DVD and for download by anybody any time keeps the whole incident as fresh as if it’s occurring in the room next door. It is Chua Soi Lek’s own animal lusts and his exposed hypocrisy which has caused this unforgettable blot on himself and MCA.

    But to pin most of the blame of MCA’s tattered support on Chua’s romp would likely be a mistake. Contrast him with Bill Clinton, who was similarly exposed, although minus the videography. Clinton has managed to regain his stature in a way which Chua has not. Why? Isn’t America full of Christian “evangelicals” all speaking English? Shouldn’t all those 100m+ white Christian “evangelical” Anglophiles all be castigating Clinton non-stop till he plunges into hell for the sin of oral sex with a woman not his wife?

    No, the Chua adultery is hardly the reason for MCA’s decline, and neither is your imagined CeCA dominance. It is MCA’s demonstrated relentless obeisance to UMNO and UMNO’s own decline and criminal behaviour which is the reason for MCA’s oblivion.

    Before I end this section, I want to ask you why Anwar’s alleged and acquitted Sodomy 1 is still being played up the oh-so-forgiving 98.87% of the population 14 years after it allegedly and acquittedly happened? I could go on poking holes in your CeCA demographic analysis, but time and space constrain me.

    Section 4:

    This one is truly bizarre. Apparently The Star, a newspaper that is held in contempt and read only for amusement and “what’s that chaw kau talking about today” curiosity by most of the presumably CeCA and ABU crowd, is helping MCA’s demise by being (1) pro-CeCA through its (2) anti-BN stance due to its (3) money-mindedness and (4) its refusal to behave like something that is “part of any election machinery” (your words, not mine).

    First off, I’d like to note your unashamed lack of journalistic ethics which is surprising given your supposed journalistic background. Second, shouldn’t a paper which is (1), (2), (3) and (4) be flying off the newstands given the “dominance” of the DAP CeCAs in controlling the 98.87% of the population with diametrically opposite core values? Third, wouldn’t this also lead to a resurgence of support for the MCA which is not only talking like the DAP CeCAs, but daringly defying its political masters UMNO in doing so and thus champion the Chinese cause, whatever that is (I don’t subscribe to any race’s cause, I just want to optimize this country’s prospects).

    Conclusion:

    It is obvious you write without logical thinking. You draw conclusions which fly in the face of all the available evidence, and relate people, events and issues which are not even remotely related. You make outrageous statements, yet do not provide outrageous proof. And I am truly shocked by your lack of journalistic ethics. Is that why you’re an ex-journalist? Your bosses fired you for your incessant one-sided partisan stories as part of that “election machinery” you call a newspaper?

    In spite of all this, I think you’re a nice person at heart. Somehow. I don’t know why. Just very misguided. I’m praying for your healing and rest. And wisdom and courage. There is a God, and I hope that one day you will be able to open your heart and receive Him.

    Balas
    • 20. Helen Ang  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 6:09 pm

      Amazing! Thanks for the Show & Tell, Makin Cuci Makin Kotor.

      If all your fellow PJ Christians were like you, then the volume (both in quantity and pitch) of loudness and aggression displayed by your minority group against the majority, i.e. everybody else, is explained. Voila.

      Since your first comment made here in my “little-visited blog” only some 36 hours ago, you have:

      (1) “subjunctively” labelled me “Helen of Trolls”, “a cheap caricaturist”, accused me of hypocrisy

      (2) allege that I attack DAP non-stop, that I accuse DAP of Chinese racism but at the same time claim that I’ve conceded “the DAP is trying its darnedest not to be racists” (nope, those are your words and not what I meant at all – readers here know the DAP evangelist pollies are chameleons in skin)

      (3) said the “reprehensible function” of my blog is to “distract Malaysians from the big issues of government incompetence, government crime and government-sponsored racism”

      (4) wondered aloud if I was being paid (by whom, you did not say) and said aloud also that my newspaper “bosses fired” me (albeit tagging a question mark — same modus operandi as your “wondering aloud” if I receive payment for blogging)

      (5) opined, “I really think you need psychiatric help” and proposed, “Please do get yourself examined psychiatrically”,

      (6) demanded me again, again, again and again to conduct a Facebook poll so that I will be subjected to a popularity test by Facebook users – as if the number of Twits willing to back an idea is a measure of its truth

      (7) and like Kim Guan Eng – when an audio recording was produced to prove that he had indeed made statements about crime in Johor despite his earlier denial – you when cornered, make a reluctant admission “I cannot find the [Star] article” but necessarily coupled with endless putar-belit as to why the article cannot be found.

      Seven Habits of “Highly Effective” People?

      And you’re the guy who thumps his chest declaring, “I have not called anybody names”.

      Looking at what you’ve been able to produce in a mere 36 hours of commenting activity, I think other readers would now be more willing to believe how it is that the non-pribumi Christians, although small in population numbers, are punching aggression above their weight.

      Balas
      • 21. HM, hk  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 10:55 pm

        Yes, kind of like Malaysia’s home grown scientology. They certainly mirror each other’s behaviour. Is it a religion or is it a cult?

        Balas
      • 22. Makin Cuci Makin Kotor  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 8:19 am

        Helen,

        First, with respect to my posts, you have made numerous disparaging inferences as to my Christianity, and I have not even once mentioned your religious beliefs nor disparaged your religion. It’s alright. I’ll just let that one fly over your head.

        Second, as I’ve shown in great detail, and you have not even attempted to show otherwise, this blog post on Muhyddin slapping MCA around is just a hopeless and long-winded train wreck of non-sequiturs and self-contradictions. You cut-and-paste your favourite hobby horses on one webpage and that is somehow good copy?

        And this is not your only headless chicken of a blog post.

        In another post, you featured Hannah Yeoh, your number one hobby horse of all time, in a supposed expose in which she is “connected” to the City Harvest Church’s alleged scandal and to CHC KL which was allegedly part of the money laundering trail and how she is such a great danger to danger to suraus and mosques and especially children during Ramadhan.

        Note to readers: For those who have yet to feast themselves on Helen’s witch’s brew of a post, she wrote and cut-and-pasted something entitled “Hannah Yeoh’s connection with City Harvest Church / Reverend’s bogus PhD?”. Remember this title, it’s important.

        In it, she started by asking if CHC was a cult, then went on to something about ‘dakwah’, then wrote something about megachurches, then went on to the CHC case and then suddenly her favourite hobby horse Hannah Yeoh appears interspersed with details of money laundering allegations and disappears (note, Hannah Yeoh was the titular figure of this post) and then this no-head-no-tail post goes into something about the rise of megachurches in Southeast Asia, then casts aspersions on CHC pastor’s honorary doctorate in Business Administration, then casts ASIDE aspersions of said doctorate, introduces doubts about his theological doctorate, drags in The Star’s supposed refusal to behave like an MCA lackey, drags in UMNO’s displeasure with the MCA for not being able to make The Star behave like and MCA lackey, advocates that The Star be compelled by MCA to “immediately start pulling their weight” and act like “its own mainstream media machinery” (instead of a national newspaper reporting the news, presumably).

        For a post entitled “Hannah Yeoh’s connection with City Harvest Church / Reverend’s bogus PhD?” you’d expect it to start and end with YB Hannah Yeoh and everywhere in between, no? Apparently not. Poor Hannah Yeoh. She pops up like an advertisement somewhere in the middle, mingles with some laundered money, tweets, and disappears never to be heard from again (until the next headless chicken post, of course, Helen luuuuurrrrveeesss Hannah Yeoh, who is to be blamed for everything and anything under the sun, especially the Christian sun!!!). And to make up for this deficiency of the titular YB, the reader is treated to some two dozen other hobby horses all springing up and trotting off without warning.

        If you, the reader, doubts my analysis, please go read “Hannah Yeoh’s connection with City Harvest Church / Reverend’s bogus PhD?” for yourself. Don’t take my word for it. See it for yourself!!!

        Balas
        • 23. Helen Ang  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 11:13 am

          You wrote:

          “Helen, you have made numerous disparaging inferences as to my Christianity, and I have not even once mentioned your religious beliefs nor disparaged your religion. It’s alright. I’ll just let that one fly over your head.”

          Please show where I’ve made the “disparaging” remarks. As to your claim not to have disparaged my religion, granted, but look at your other comments:

          unethical“, ” journalistic standards swimming in the gutter”, “unethical“, “unethical” …

          Your carping about “un-ethics” like an old broken record is like the thief shouting “thief” and pointing his finger in his opposite direction.

          “Helen of Trolls”, “a cheap caricaturist”,

          You say I’m full of hypocrisy, illogical, irrational, incoherent, “lack of perspective”, unreasonable, not “making sense”, “crazy with rage”, operating a “reprehensible” blog,

          made the innuendo I’m a prostitute selling my writing services,

          implied that I was sacked from my job,

          opined, “I really think you need psychiatric help” and proposed, “Please do get yourself examined psychiatrically”,

          “another train wreck”, “proverbial train wreck”

          Now compare with your description of a DAP rep:

          “As for Hannah Yeoh’s testimony in church, the only person for whom this is of any concern is God, and I’d daresay he was delighted with His good and faithful servant, Hannah Yeoh.”

          Considering your verbal diarrhea against me the last 48 hours, what need is there for you to disparage my religion? Isn’t the above enough?

          *** *** ***

          As for your assurance, “There is a God, and I hope that one day you will be able to open your heart and receive Him”,

          My response: I very much pray that you and the DAP evangelist politicians you adore are not made in the image of your God b’cos you’re not at all a convincing advertisement in persuading me.

          Balas
      • 24. Makin Cuci Makin Kotor  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 4:54 pm

        Helen,

        Thanks for conceding that I’ve not disparaged your religion despite your numerous attacks on mine. Please note also that I’ve not disparaged ANY religion in all my voluminous writings here in the past 48 hours.

        When I say you’re unethical and your posts are illogical, lack perspective, and a train wreck of non-sequiturs, etc., I am asking for you to demonstrate how they are otherwise.

        It would be a simple thing for you to show, with regards the respective blog posts, how one section relates to the next, logically and substantively, and to its titular subject matter.

        For example, in the case of your post “Hannah Yeoh’s connection with City Harvest Church / Reverend’s bogus PhD” all you need to do, to debunk my analysis, is to show how Hannah Yeoh is “connected” to CHC and the alleged scandal and children being brainwashed by megachurches and suraus and mosques being in danger of receiving her state-allocated funds and the two dozen other things brought up in that post.

        It is a very simple thing I’m asking. Just explain the train of thought involved in these blog posts.

        The fact that you don’t suggests that you can’t, and that my analyses of these blog posts are accurate.

        Balas
        • 25. Helen Ang  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 6:16 pm

          Re: my alleged “numerous attacks” on your religion.

          My reply is in the same vein as to your earlier charge where you’d claimed that I attacked DAP.

          I rebutted saying that with the exception of LGE and HY (+ the former’s pol-secs Ng Wei Aik & Zairil), hardly anyone else from DAP merits more than a passing mention in this blog and 99% don’t feature.

          And unlike the chants of “ABU” and “Kuburkan Umno” and what not, I’ve not campaigned against DAP the party.

          Frankly, I do not want to see DAP kill off MCA (which it looks like it’ll successfully do)… that’s all.

          Unlike the Firsters, I really wish for a check & balance. I want MCA to continue living so that it can check & balance DAP. I do not want to leave the task of checking & balancing solely to Umno (should MCA be destroyed), which will then translate into Malay vs Chinese.

          Now you’re claiming I attack Christianity numerously.

          I shall counter that in my word usage, I’ve predominantly specified “DAP evangelist”. To this, you can further add the adjective Anglophile. This really narrows the field to a small focus — regular readers can even pinpoint which ‘person(s)’

          Therefore, how can deconstructing M’sian individual(s) active in confrontational politics be equated to attacking Christianity?

          Secondly, many of the postings concern CHC and touch on worldly matters such as CBT (fraud, misappropriation of funds, brainwashing, pastor’s wife’s Hollywood lifestyle, their plush apartments, etc).

          Since CHC was created in S’pore only some 2 decades ago, aren’t you the one insulting your own religion – which has a long history of 2 millennia and commands a worldwide following – by lowering it to the level of status equation with an alleged fraudster church? Or to flip the premise, my writing negatively about CHC is taken as attacking Christianity (why so?)

          In fact, you should questioning whether CHC is truly representing a religion or is it a money-raking cult?

          Take the CHC trance dancing where the youth prance around under disco lights and flick their tongues in & out like lizards. You should be more worried about the bad impression of Christianity that CHC is giving to adherents of other religions, rather than embarking on the voluminous slander effort against me.

          Try answering honestly, faithfully to your God on this.

          Balas
      • 26. Makin Cuci Makin Kotor  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 5:04 pm

        Oh yeah, with regards my accusation that you are unethical, that is solely related to your advocacy for The Star to be turned from a pro-DAP publication (as you allege) to one that is pro-MCA through the intervention of its owners and paymasters, the Malaysian CHINESE Association or MCA.

        My position, which is also what is taught in Journalism & Ethics 101, is that newspapers should just report the news plus some balanced fact-based analysis and commentary. Any publication engaged in promoting political parties, especially those which sign its paychecks, is just a brochure and should be treated as such.

        And anyone advocating such is unethical and a disgrace to the profession. That’s you, by the way.

        Balas
      • 27. Makin Cuci Makin Kotor  |  Julai 22, 2012 at 3:35 am

        Note: This is my final post on your blog, and I’ve decided to write it like you do. It’s all for fun, really, because I’m so tired of talking sense to you. So do humour me, ok?

        Gosh, I analysed and took apart your entire train wreck of non-sequiturs of a blog post and you had nothing to say about it? I must have been completely spot on to shut you up like that!

        Of course, you did post a response but instead of countering my analysis with your own, you just go on and on moaning around my conclusions without actually saying exactly how I was wrong.

        I’ve observed that’s pretty much how you respond to almost all challenges on your blog.

        After you’re done moaning around what your detractors said, you will most times climb up your all-purpose hobby horse ” and say something along the lines of: ” “That *Disparaging Nickname* is a *label* *label* *label* that’s why he/she *stereotype* *stereotype* *stereotype*!”

        And then you’ll dredge out all your other hobby horses – Hannah Yeoh, Lim Guan Eng, DAP and Christians – and give them one grand sweeping swipe after another, then move to your favourite fake DAP mole – The Star – and moan about how it’s crippling the MCA by acting like a real newspaper when it’s actually universally reviled as an MCA parrot.

        One frequent feature is how the vindictive Chinese evangelistic Christian Anglophiles (at most 1.13% of the population, but hey who’s counting) in DAP caused MCA’s demise simply by periodically reminding the oh-so-forgiving and peace-loving non-Christian non-evangelical non-Anglophile Chinese-educated Chinese of Chua Soi Lek’s videotaped adultery in a JB hotel room. For Helen, it’s always the DAP’s appendage pointing at Chua Soi Lek that is the criminal, not Chua Soi Lek’s pointy appendage recorded for posteriority.

        Of course, for Helen, the MCA’s demise has nothing to do with its 55 years of stupefied silence when UMNO amended the constitution 700 times, made up one new Malay special right after another (and one new race made Malay after another, but that would be digressing), rearing cows in condos, buying multi-billion ringgit surfing submarines and jetless jets, blowing up a pregnant Mongolian translator all because she wanted her FAIR share of corrupt money (the nerve!) and forming that Uber Alles team the Jaguh Kampung Malay Supremacists *Zieg heil!* Perkasa.

        This is what passes for political commentary on your blog.

        When I stumbled on your blog purely by accident two days ago, it was such a fascinating place with mostly syiok sendiri labeling-cum-stereotyping types all falling over themselves labeling and stereotyping people who don’t agree with them. Coming from a background where labeling and stereotyping is highly discouraged and ideas are actually constructively discussed, your blog was like some exotic alien planet! So I stayed.

        After a while, I noticed that name calling was your mother tongue and anyone who doesn’t belong to your labeling club and who doesn’t think like you do will have disparaging nicknames made up for them, and given compound adjectival names with suffixes like “ster” “ical” “tian” “ist” “ese” or “ilk”.

        Oh, and woe betide anyone who says anything negative about Helen or her blog. That’ll be name calling. ONLY Helen and her fawning admirers can call people names! Her name calling is made right by two-wrongs – Christians and more Christians.

        Back to the second person, singular:

        The quality of thought in your posts is so bad, Helen, it’s good. My friend was just rolling around the floor laughing reading your post on Hannah Yeoh and City Harvest. He concluded that all you do is glue everything together with your hatred for Christians, and so anything and everything is related to you (after all, there are 2 billion Christians on Earth, so pretty much everything is related to a Christian somehow, making these things all related to one another, and thus finding their way to Helen’s blog posts, all linked up with with the carriage return!). I have a clever friend.

        Really, I don’t know what kind of QC you’re doing here. Almost every post is just one long and long-winded, rage-filled cut-and-paste job of anything remotely related to your favourite hobby horses held together by the blank lines in between them.

        After watching my friend roll around the floor laughing at your blog post, I’ve come to realise that anybody who can think would have immediately classified your blog as a low-quality haters club and left after a good laugh. And your fawning fans are mostly those who label and stereotype for entertainment or political advancement, and so are unlikely to be swayed no matter how good the logic.

        So why should I spend my time taking apart your blog posts when it’s not going to make any difference to anybody else?

        I just pity the few deep-thinking, sincere, patriotic people here. They are really wasting their time. To these few, I’d urge you to throw your weight behind the change movement. Join a political party not affiliated with our hopeless race-based ruling coalition and kick out UMNO and its stupefied hangers on in the GE13.

        Fifty-five years is a lot of second chances, and nothing in the recent past suggests things are going to change. In fact, BN’s contempt for the Rule of Law seems to be getting worse.

        Remember that the biggest factor in the GE13 is going to be cheating, and thus we need to over-vote for Pakatan just so it can get a legitimate share of seats in Parliament.

        So, this is me signing off, Helen. After the initial novelty, I realise I’ve got far more important and interesting things to do. I won’t be completely gone, though. Every once in a while, I do watch a bad movie just to see how bad it can be, hoping for something so bad it’s actually good.

        Balas
      • 28. Makin Cuci Makin Kotor  |  Julai 22, 2012 at 10:19 am

        I know I said my last post was my last post, but I just saw your post asking me to answer faithfully to God about CHC, and I’m going to respond only in this respect since you asked me to respond to God about it.

        Please note that a court case is underway and all the things said about CHC is pending the court’s judgment. Also, I am speaking only so far as my ability as a human being allows me to see. I acknowledge that God’s ways are higher than mine and his thoughts higher than mine, and I will never really know the truth until I meet Him face to face (hopefully).

        Insofar as my human ability allows me to judge, my position on CHC is that (1) it is highly likely that there was serious wrong doing with respect the use of church funds and the subsequent cover up, (2) the pastor’s wife’s behaviour was highly inappropriate although she had relinquished her position as a pastor of the church, as she was still the wife of the senior pastor and should thus have behaved like one, and (3) the very luxurious lifestyle of the senior pastor and his wife reflects badly on them, suggesting that the other charges against them are also true, and is certainly not how Jesus taught his disciples to live e.g. “Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.” (Matthew 19:21-23).

        However, as to whether CHC is a money-raking cult or not, that is not for us to decide. Only God can judge whether it is a money-raking cult. It all depends whether the true work of God was done, despite whatever shortcomings CHC had. I can say, however, its rather insistent preaching of the Prosperity Gospel (not Biblical) suggests it does prioritise money above faith. Again, this is my earthly view.

        About youths trance dancing and prancing under disco lights in CHC, I don’t know since I have not seen this for myself since I have never been to CHC. In the Bible, it is recorded that King David (= Daud in the Quran) praised God with complete abandon with the hottest music of the time played to accompany him e.g. “And David danced before the LORD with all his might; and David was girded with a linen ephod (i.e he was shirtless). So David and all the house of Israel brought up the ark of the Lord with shouting, and with the sound of the trumpet.” (2 Samuel 6:14-15).

        So loud music and hot dance moves without a shirt is Biblical, as long as your heart is solely focused on God. So who are we to say CHC’s youths were not Godly in their dancing and music? Only God can decide what was in their hearts.

        And then how they “flick their tongues in & out like lizards”. This one is complete nonsense and a misrepresention of the act of praying in tongues (this was said by a non-Christian and reported by another). Praying in tongues, Christians believe, is a manifestation of being infilled by the Holy Spirit i.e. a gift from God. It is recorded in the Bible e.g. “And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost/Spirit, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.” (Acts 2:4).

        The sounds we make when praying in tongues can be of any nature, as the Spirit leads, and not necessarily (and unlikely to be) lizard like. In fact, most times, it sounds like a foreign language or language not this world. Praying in tongues is for the edification of oneself, so this verbalisation is not ordinarily meant for someone else to interpret (although there is a corresponding gift of the Holy Spirit known as the interpretation of tongues).

        That is all I have to say, since I believe it is necessary to put forth what is Godly and true. I hope this has been useful to your readers.
        _____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

        Thank you for the enlightening info about “loud music and hot dance moves without a shirt”, and speaking in tongues. — Helen

        Balas
  • 29. shamshul anuar  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 2:43 pm

    helen,

    What many Chinese do not realise is that they will eventually be the losers should they continue to pander to DAP’s antics.

    Many laugh when I said repeatedly that DAP is bringing Chinese into collision course with the Malays. They accused me of trying to scare the Malays.

    But I firmly believe that eventually a clash will start, triggering misery on massive scale. Chinese must realise that they must not expect the Malays to continue to give in while they refuse to integrate with the rest of Malaysians LET ALONE compromise.

    The “allah” is a classic case of problem created out of nothing. Not even one word “Allah” appears in Bible, old or King James version. Yet, DAP made it as if Christians persecuted here. And MCA tagged along , just curious to be seen as sensitive to Christian needs.

    And none of them talk about the need to respect the sensitivities of Muslims as it affects the very foundation of Islam. For Muslims here, this is worse than Portuegese invasion of Malacca or Spanish reconquest of andalusia.

    Balas
  • 30. temenggong  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 4:28 pm

    Very acute observations Helen. Star has a weak editorial board with no social scholars aboard.

    Balas
  • 31. jonnymalaya  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 5:07 pm

    The BN deputy chairman needs to look at himself. His boss is talking about 1Malaysia and so on, but he goes around saying he’s Malay first, and supporting all these chauvinist pressure groups.

    And then, UMNO acts unilaterally like the abang besar in Barisan Nasional, while the other parties have to put up. How do you expect MCA, MIC, Gerakan, et all to go around and say we will be treated fairly under BN, 1Malaysia, et cetra, while UMNO goes ranting and raving about defending the race from the bangsa asing?

    If my brother who is also my business partner goes around mismanaging the company, how can I say to investors that their investments are safe with us? With a straight face some more.

    Is calling the DPM to consider all Malaysians and not just him and his own race, evidence of Christianisation? Come on laa…

    Balas
    • 32. pakard  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 6:07 pm

      Jonny,

      Chauvinist pressure groups are supported by the DPM, there is no chauvinist pressure group that goes against him, or the Malays.

      Only UMNO go ranting and raving about defending their race.

      My statement satisfy you???

      Balas
  • 33. Mustapha Ong  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 5:19 pm

    Helen has chosen the right time to highlight Muhyiddin’s concern and comments why was it that difficult for MCA to understand the sentiments of the Chinese Malaysians in the present political scenario.

    As a senior UMNO member and grassroot supporter, I share the remarks by our Deputy President, who is even more senior than Najib in the party’s hierarchy, but I do believe that he had failed to see the true sentiments of the Chinese demands, particularly in education, culture, housing, SMEs and other minor business sectors of the economy. It is true that only a handful of wealthy Chinese had benefited in the political alliance but not the middle urban and rural Chinese community.

    In the context of the Chinese position within the community and different level of socio-metric representation, the Chinese are split across a few party lines, ie. MCA, Gerakan, PPP and DAP with a marginal participation of Chinese in other parties in Sarawak and Sabah. In the pre and post Merdeka days, the Chinese were more inclined to be associated with MCA due to the strong personal and party linkage between the late Tunku Abdul Rahman and the Chinese leaders who fought for our Independence together. There were very few Chinese based political parties and even Gerakan was not truly representative of the Chinese until the late 60s.

    Following the racial clashes in May, 1969 as a result of the Chinese political polarization caused by the worst general election based on racial sentiments and superiority of the Malays, the Chinese became more alienated with the departure of the Chinese influence dominated by PAP who had acceded to Singapore. As a result of the new political development that had divided the Chinese community further, DAP which had almost adopted the political clone of PAP became another Chinese based socialist party in competition with MCA and Gerakan. Thus, politically the Chinese were divided and their sentiments became prominent and more vocal in their political, economic and social demands in our society. This eventually irritated the UMNO Malay leadership from the late 60s to the early 80s within the component parties in Barisan Nasional.

    This trend had continued through the 80s, 90s and 2000s during the reign of Tun Mahathir, who in his earlier years was known as anti Chinese (Pai Hua). Thus the dominant Malays in UMNO became racialist which had driven the urban and semi-urban Chinese to support DAP rather than MCA and Gerakan. However, over the last few general elections, DAP had only managed to make a small infiltration into the mainstream political scene and at the same time being checked by the increasing popularity of the Malays in PAS.

    In the late 80s and early 90s, the Malays in UMNO were split due to the party squabbling between Tun Mahathir and Tengku Razaleigh in which the former almost lost his reign in UMNO. UMNO was declared illegal in 1988 by the ROS and was de-registered. However, subsequently UMNO was revived within one month and was re-registered as UMNO (Baru), Tengku Razaleigh resigned from UMNO and subsequently formed Semangat 46 but failed to make any political inroad to unseat UMNO and further divided the Malays.

    In the meantime, the Chinese dominant parties like MCA and Gerakan failed to progress further in order to get the support of the Chinese community due to the non partisan of the Chinese business community and other affluent Chinese of different religious alienation. Today, with the improved political opportunity of DAP in the wake of political collaboration together with PKR and PAS in the 1004 general election, DAP is seemingly the strongest Chinese opposition party in Malaysia. It is due to this sentiments and understandable that the Chinese majority are not outwardly supporting MCA and Gerakan but they are firmly behind DAP, even though they are never comfortable with PAS and PKR.

    In this context and change of heart among the younger urban and semi-urban Chinese community, there is very little hope that they will support MCA and Gerakan in exchange for DAP, which I believe has a strong hold in Penang politics. Under this radical political scenario, the Chinese will support Najib as the prime Minister due to his dominant personality, which will come from the Chinese business community, NGOs, social and community Associations.

    Balas
    • 34. I hate n'sync  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 1:44 am

      The failure of MCA and Gerakan is the concern of UMNO and BN. If the component parties fail to find a point to pivot and reconnect with their electorate, then both are mere decorative appendages and should be treated as such.

      Of course, I doubt the DPM is making the job easier for the likes of CSL and LTL.

      The problem here is this, UMNO needs MCA and Gerakan desperately, but not at the price of bending over backwards to meet the unreasonable demands of the DJZ and other pressure groups. The Kuantan ICHS is an example. DJZ and New Era openly declares this period as their golden opportunity to press for a COMPLETE Chinese education system in this country.

      What kind of message does this kind of opportunistic behaviour sends?
      ________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

      “a COMPLETE Chinese education system” (??) = Malaysia First reverse takeover? — Helen

      Balas
  • 35. rotiAbu  |  Julai 20, 2012 at 8:55 pm

    selamat menjalani ibadah puasa kepada semua Muslimin dan Muslimat. Boleh tinggalkan sebentar bab politik dan fokus pada amal ibadah di bulan yang mulia ini.

    Balas
  • 36. Mustapha Ong  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 8:14 am

    Kenyataan rotiAbu amatlah tepat….kita umat Islam kenalah menghormati dan menghayati kesucian semasa bulan Ramadhan yang penuh dengan berbagai-bagai kefitrahan Islam dan banyak beribadat. Salam Ramadhan dan selamat berpuasa kepada semua rakan-rakan maya Helen blogspot.

    Balas
  • 37. Tok Rojak  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 11:12 am

    IHnS (#8 & #10). Precisely, you have made pertinent points to this whole debate of the place of Christians in Malaysia & especially their make-up and demography.

    First, we talk about cohesiveness and the use of Bahasa Malaysia across Malaysian life (that is why the continuing saga of venacular schools). However, in the use of a language (any language), there mustn’t be limitations of usage. Most of the words banned by the home ministry isn’t used by Christians or in daily usage (like “rasulah”) but words commonly shared is like “Allah” & “nabi” etc.

    Without going into the etymology of the word “Allah” in particular its pre-Arabic/Middle eastern roots (ie. pre-Islam), the point being made is that Malaysian Christians (especially East Malaysians) are using the Indonesian Bible rather than a “Malay/Malaysian Bible.” A very early Malay translation (portions) was made in early colonial times but was never adopted.

    Understanding the concern by certain quarters of prostylizing, the point be made is that the Indonesian Bible (“Alkitab” is also another senstitive word in our context) is freely printed & used in Indonesia because it is recognised that in language, if it is to be used and adopted by others, it should not have certain restrictions of usage. This is a universal principle. Freedom of usage in Indonesia is also reaffirmed based on the principle of Pancasila.

    Secondly, for a West Malaysian Christian, we can easily subsitute “Tuhan” for the word “Allah”. No need to fight over semantics when the whole concept & idea of God is more important. But how about the other terms that are commonly shared? What should the East Malaysians use?

    In Iban (and in their translated Iban Bible), their term for God is “Allah Taala” another derivative.

    The point made is that when we usually talk about certain hot button issues, East Malaysians are more than often discounted in the equation. West Malaysians Christians can read & practice their faith in any other language but with our policy to assimilate all Malaysians, we have discounted the fact that East Malaysians use BM more in their daily lives. We have also forgotten that they were Christians long before Sabah & Sarawak joined the Federation.

    But the interesting fact highlighted by IHnS and others is that a majority of Christians are Bumiputras (including Orang Asli) and the smaller minority made up of Chinese… and yes… Indians, Serani (Eurasians) and newly assimilated Indonesians (especially Bataks). But the syllogism used in comments here always points to the disdain of Chinese Christians because a few politically radicalized their views encapsulated with faith and religious terminology.

    However, in the same breath where the “dan lain2″ (in this case for the sake of this argument – Chinese) can so easily adapt/change the use of terms can also be equally vocal about East Malaysians being deprive of the use of a language in which they are expected to use for this very same assmilation exercise. Its a matter of fair play.

    Balas
    • 38. Helen Ang  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 11:29 am

      Tok Rojak,

      I’ve touched on the use of BM by Sabahans/S’wakians in a Jan 2010 article, see here.

      I think it is hypocrisy for the evangelist Chinese DAP Christians in the peninsula who are most contemptuous of BM to be championing the contentious translated Bible terminology in bahasa Indonesia. Are the DAPsters at the same time willing to tackle the larger issue of lingua franca or do they just want to throw tantrums and demand shared possession of the ‘Allah’ word only?

      Earlier, the Malay bureaucracy accommodated (close one eye) the East M’sians. Now the spirit of accommodation is no longer there. But pls don’t just blame the Muslims alone for this deterioration. Look at the DAPster “perpetual hysteria”.

      Balas
      • 39. Tok Rojak  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 12:18 pm

        Then this is precisely my point from the beginning.. the seperation of State & religion (in a very defined use here). When religion is politicized, it takes another form… the ugly kind. Opening a Pandora’s box that can never be shut.

        Therefore, DAP or whatever party should just stick to politics and not trying to earn brownie points on religion, enviromental issues, poverty issue etc unless they have something concrete & postive to contribute besides rhetorics and sloganeering….

        For example, its laughable that even a solar-powered Bible can become a political issue to the chagrin of both of Christians & non-Christians, especially in a digital age. We can still remember those hand-wound cassette players taken into rural areas in Africa & India to help in illiteracy programs in the 70′s. Does the good member of the state assembly mean that a certain group of people in Malaysia still live in a stone age enviroment whereby Christian evangelist need to use these solar run Bibles in these places? All arguments are double edged.

        The second point is that in all our discussions, we seem to make as if East Malaysians don’t exist in our national discourse of what Malaysians want… its a perpetual Malay-Chinese thingy…

        “Earlier, the Malay bureaucracy accommodated (close one eye) the East M’sians. Now the spirit of accommodation is no longer there.”

        Lastly, ironically speaking although I’ve argued that in many ways, we seem to exclude East Malaysians as full citizens of the Federation in policy making & economic development, they actually couldn’t care less – especially State leaders (except grassroot citizens especially for economic progress verses their brethen in the West) what the bureaucracy thinks…. Case in point – Pek Moh or even the Sabah leaders. As pointed out previously, Pek Moh isn’t even Malay but Melanau.

        Balas
        • 40. Helen Ang  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 12:30 pm

          To clarify, when I said “Earlier, the Malay bureaucracy accommodated (close one eye) the East M’sians”, I was speaking strictly in the context of the ‘Allah’ and other word use.

          The prohibited words were gazetted by the Home Ministry in the 1980s if I’m not mistaken, as well as separately in states like S’gor but there has been no strict enforcement (I’m making a generalization of recent trend which may discount specific cases, which there probably are).

          This trend may lead to a Muslim-Christian clash, which in M’sia splits along the line of polarized races.

          Balas
      • 41. HuaYong  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 12:58 pm

        “its a perpetual Malay-Chinese thingy…”

        not really, sabah during 1985-1995 were equally talked about, most of my sarawakian classmate told me sabahan were smart and sarawakian were stupid during that time. now some want to make it a malay + pribumi vs chinese to carry on their rule, u r always in their mind when needed.

        Balas
  • 42. Tok Rojak  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 1:16 pm

    Thanks for the clarification since the statement seem to mean something else. Actually, I had another paragraph after my last sentence but deleted it.

    Ah So… you made another relevant point which was in my deleted paragraph….. “The prohibited words were gazetted by the Home Ministry in the 1980s if I’m not mistaken.” This is precisely why politicians cannot be trusted…. If I’m not mistaken, a leader of a certain opposition party whilst in government started this sublime attack on Christians especially the banning of certain terms and literature from Indonesia…. go back to the 80′s and who was pushing his ideals through?

    Therefore, this deterioration lies in certain wheels that were set in motion by certain individual parties in the 80′s and recently rehashed by ultra nationalist & solar enthusiast to muck rack religion for politics.

    Not sure about DAP’s “pepetual hysteria” but Christians surely don’t need them nor PKR, nor MCA (yes, even certain Christian assemblymen) to make statements on behalf of the community unless there is something substantive to say.

    But back to my initial point…. why must there be a Malay-Chinese clash? Or Muslim-Christian clash? Or even worst Malay Muslim-Chinese Christian clash? Hey, the majority of Christians here are Bumiputras!! Why just a West Malaysian thingy? Why doesn’t East Malaysians brought into the discussions that keep going on and on on venacular schools, NEP etc….

    While perceiving accreditting DAP the major blame, doesn’t it take two to clap?

    Sideline: What happen to words that we use to live-by like “Muhibbah”, “Rukun Negara” and “Rukun Tetangga”? Not once in the last few years going through MSM and alternative media I hear these words espoused. Instead, now we have neighbourhoods hiring security firms and locking the neighbourhood down, suspicion of our neighbours and their intentions, you do your thing & I do my thing mentality.

    Balas
    • 43. Helen Ang  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 1:44 pm

      The perception problem.

      A parallel illustration: The Satu Sekolah proponents blame SRJK(C) for the DAPsterism they see. On the contrary, whatever biadab online comments – a point of complaint in their memo to the DPM-Education Minister – which our SSS friends would have encountered must have been written in English, and not Chinese.

      From their Facebook profiles, I see the worst DApsters (commenting in English in MK, MI, M2Day etc, as well as assuming SSS folks are not being irked by Chinese-language blogopshere which they mostly don’t read or understand) belonging to the Convent or mission school or Penang-based Facebook networks.

      Similarly the situation in this blog: I have accepted comments submitted in hanyu, Tamil and even French but all the DAPster assaults against me were written in English (not in BM either and none in Chinese character-writing (hanzi) – Camelot’s Hokkien transliteration doesn’t count).

      On to your Q. why “Malay Muslim-Chinese Christian clash when the majority of Christians here are Bumiputras?”

      Answer, perception as above. Like JonnyMalaya pointed out, the churches fire-bombed the last round were not SIB & the incidents happened mostly in peninsula, not in Sabah or S’wak among the native Christians.

      Like it or not, Chinese will bear the brunt of the Allah unhappiness even tho’ it is not the Chinese who desire to use the Bahasa Indonesia bible.

      From the attitude displayed by Makin Cuci Makin Kotor, Camelot and their ilk, are you surprised that it’s turning out a Chinese vs Malay thingy? Idris Jala and his native Christian tribes do not get into the face of the Malays like DApsters do.

      Balas
      • 44. Tok Rojak  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 2:34 pm

        Helen, my simplistic response is two words: the need for a “scape goat” to detract us from the real issues like poverty among the Malays, Orang Asli, Indians on estates, the deplorable left behind state of East Malaysians especially in the rural areas. (Chinese are excluded to a certain extent due to their demograph, moving more towards urbanized clusters).

        The second is “mudah atau mungkin sudah lupa”. Some may keep harping on the disparity of the “haves” and “have-nots” (ala NEP issue and believing that Chinese want changes in this area) but I strongly believe that this issue is confined to the 60′s & 70′s. Although disparity is still relevant, it isn’t just giving “hand-outs” or closing the disparity gap which is vital. What is vital is lifting the poor out of poverty though education, training programs, social enterprises etc….

        But instead, we are starting to see a “class war” (the real picture) – as Karim Ruslan succiently put it… The rural folks verses the Bangsar/Anglophine folks. eg. Haris Ibrahim, Syed Akbar Ali, Rocky Bru, countless tycoons and even ahem,,, our leaders who were born & bred Oxbridge… (eg. the Malay politician that can connect with grassroot Malays vs the leader that still thinks in English).

        This is why, it is “perceived” that the Chinese are mischief makers with much help from the biadap DAP. However, it suits everyone well politically to have such a view. For some, to find the villian, for others, to become the hero that saves both race, argument and the day. Mind you, this can be inter-changable depending on the flavour of the subsequent elections but the main protagonist remains – the Chinese and now Christian Chinese.

        As an urban, English speaking Chinese – Anglophile or whatnot still believes that the NEP should be twig but to be redefined for the “rural” Malays and “left-out” ethnic groups (as mentioned above). If something is not done in a more solid & practical way, the human nature is to be attracted to the call of the heavenly vision – messianic or otherwise (not talking about the CHC thingy and its psychic/sociological impact on middle class affluent young people) but rather…..

        However, again, I repeat my question – what happen to “muhibbah”. “rukun negara” and “rukun tetangga”?

        We are surely keeping you busy on a lazy Saturday afternoon…
        _____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

        Will reply shortly. Lemme clear the other comments first. — Helen

        Balas
        • 45. Helen Ang  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 10:00 pm

          Essentially, you’re pondering on whether the Chinese are being made the scapegoat and bogeyman b’cos we’re the expedient target?

          If I had to choose between a strict Yes or No, I’d sadly have to say ‘yes’.

          But bearing in mind that this is generally the fate of minorities everywhere who do not assimilate. Malaysian Chinese not only refuse to assimilate but (… roll my eyes).

          The attitude to bahasa kebangsaan is a clear indicator. I’m not sure if we will ever come across any citizens anywhere else in the world so contemptuous of their country’s national language. And added to this are all kinds of self-justification for the attitude, like BM no standard, impractical, useless, blah blah blah.

          Comparatively, I think the Malays – due to their own laidback nature – have let us be (a largely hands-off approach) & we’re left to our Chinese schools, speaking our Chinese tongues, etc.

          Do we want this outcome? To me yes — wanna keep Chinese schools, keep Chinese language/culture. It’s a balancing act and there’s the cost to pay.

          Let’s say the govt offers a quid pro quo deal: They will open up residential schools and MRSMs and matriculation to all regardless of race. Okay, let’s throw in UiTM as well. But in exchange, vernacular schools will have to be closed. What will be our decision given this option?

          The pribumi Christians are not first choice targets in the ‘Allah’ row b’cos they look Malay, they speak Malay and are Malay in their adat.

          But compare how the City Harvest teens dress with a typical kebangsaan school where the whole class of Malay girls all wear the uniform white tudung. The more different we are – easily discernible outwardly – the more suspicion we’re going to be greeted with.

          In other countries, assimilation has been either forced or embraced voluntarily, like the Aussie Chinese adopting a twang indistinguishable from the locals.

          This is the reality.

          Let’s look at the Pakatan con. Briefly, on whether Pakatan cares about the have-nots or in other words, can we expect them to be any better than BN?

          Rather than be taken in by their sweet talk and empty promises, just keep in mind how Pakatan treated Hindraf (as representative of a marginalized minority).

          Are Pakatan capable of providing solutions to the Religion and Race divide? Nope, they’re making things worse. Isn’t the atmosphere now more fraught than pre-2008?

          Let’s take the condescending Christian, English-speaking DAPster:

          Makin Cuci Makin Kotor’s comment:

          “Some of the posters here, Helen most of all, are stuck, swirling round the turntable, broken record like, at race, religion, religious denomination, language and political party. …

          “I’m fascinated by all the name calling and labeling and pigeon-holing. It’s like I’ve landed on another planet! So refreshing!”

          Do you think hordes behaving like Makin Cuci Makin Kotor will bring us any closer to muhibbah?

          Let’s take the Rukun Negara that you cited:

          (1) Kepercayaan kepada Tuhan (no bones to pick here)
          (2) Kesetiaan kepada raja dan negara (?)
          (3) Keluhuran Perlembagaan (?)
          (4) Kedaulatan Undang-undang (?)
          (5) Kesopanan dan Kesusilaan (no need for me to comment)

          Let’s tick (3) & (4) against the DAPster attitude:

          (3) DAPster attitude to the Federal Constitution

          Quoted from Makin Cuci Makin Kotor’s comment:

          (Quote)

          “Dear I hate n’sync,

          “Thanks for clarifying on the Constitution. Yeah, I took some shortcuts when describing it! And yes, I know of these important distinctions you pointed out, but I have put them on the backburner as they don’t seem to have hindered the BN from ignoring, amending, steamrolling over and misinterpreting them in any way they want.

          Also, I am fully aware that the Constitution’s role is to protect us from the Executive, but in practice it seems to be doing nothing of the sort. This tattered and 700x amended document has been debased beyond all recognition and the only way to restore the authority of the Supreme Law of the land is to get rid of BN.” (Unquote)

          (4) DAPster attitude to the Rule of Law

          Quoted from Makin Cuci Makin Kotor’s comment:

          (Quote)

          “Over the past few years, and even more so in the past few weeks and months, BN has been relentless in its efforts to spew contempt for the Rule of Law in this country. Hardly a day passes without some lawless thing being said or done with impunity by a member of the ruling coalition.

          “I have come to the conclusion that BN is beyond redemption in its current form, and a change, even a materially flawed one, is better than allowing BN another 5 years.” (Unquote)

          What do both of Makin Cuci Makin Kotor’s responses show about the DAPster attitude?

          To (3) Keluhuran Perlembagaan, the solution is to “get rid of BN”; to Kedaulatan Undang-undang, (4) the solution is to “change the government”.

          Are Pakatan and their supporters proposing any genuine measures to solve problems?

          Back to your original musing: Can we Chinese overcome this stigmatization as scapegoat and bogeyman? Under present circumstances and the Kim leadership, obviously not.

          Never mind me as I’m not the Pakatan cup of tea.

          Let’s take you. Do you (Tok Rojak) think that if you were a government representative – say a senior, high-ranking civil servant – that you’d be able to sit down at the bargaining table with someone like MCMK standing as a representative of the opposing side for both of you to hammer out a treaty renegotiating/updating the ‘social contract’?

          Balas
  • 46. Tok Rojak  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 1:36 pm

    Hua Yong, thanks for the comments…. a few months ago, I brought up the point of the fairer skin always looking down on the darker skin…. (no, not the inter racial thingy) but even among the same ethnic group.. eg. Northern Indians and Southerners, Northern Chinese and the shorter & darker/sun tanned southeners etc…. “Sophisticated” New Yorkers verses “Red Neck” Texans. This could be an anthropological issue.

    The is a human malady!!

    Not sure about your classmate but I doubt that his observation is true.. in fact walking through Kota Kinabalu in the 80′s one could sense that the Kadazan-Dusuns were treated like strangers in their own land. Without going through the details, the minority was cold shouldering the majority beginning with USNO, then Berjaya.

    As for the Sarawakians, I doubt your friend’s observation was also true although he is indigenious. The Sarawakians (living along the coastline towns) in the 80′s were a pretty contented lot since oil and timber money was tricking down. Further, in the whole of Borneo, the only head hunters were the Ibans/Dayaks (Bidayuh’s needing to respond to a lesser degree) and Muruts/Orang Ulu (Lun Bawang, Kelabits & Murut Tagals of Southern Sabah). Therefore, I doubt they will stand being “belittled” by Sabahans since the Ibans was the political force behind gaining independence from the British in Sarawak.

    Nevertheless, the emphasis again is on a lack of a non-all inclusive policy but instead we highlight this Malay-Chinese thingy ad nauseum.

    Balas
    • 47. mekyam  |  Julai 22, 2012 at 2:26 pm

      ” “Sophisticated” New Yorkers verses “Red Neck” Texans. This could be an anthropological issue.” — Tok Rojak

      salam Tok Rojak! first, my apologies to you and others in this thread for the sidetracking i’m about to do. but your comment about “sophisticated nuyorkers vs redneck texans” brought to mind an incident i witnessed long ago. it doesn’t really disprove your anthropological hypothesis but you can say adds some chuckalable dimensions to it. : )

      one morning circa ’96 [i lived in the village then and worked midtown] i was about to walked down the subway entrance on bleeker & lafayette to take my #6 uptown when a speeding car, let’s call it car1, cut off another car which we’ll call car2, bringing it to a screeching stop.

      the driver of car1, obviously very irate, got out and started thumping the hood of the car2, screaming obcenities. when the driver of car2 stepped out, everyone watching was expecting the usual road-rage altercation. instead we heard what sounded like a pop and the screaming driver of car1 jumped back a bit, like he was being kungfued by remote control or something, before dropping like a ton of bricks on the street.

      to cut a long story short… the driver of car2, later revealed as an out-of-towner from texas driving a car with texas plate, just gave the driver of car1 [a local who was trying to show him some good ol' nuyork attitude] the texas treatment. he shot him clean thru the heart!

      Balas
      • 48. Tok Rojak  |  Julai 22, 2012 at 6:02 pm

        Well, I nearly wanted to laugh if it wasn’t so sad… However, you get the generalities in my comment… I think walking through the Bronx or Halem can be quite a cultural experience for a little nice Malaysian from Lenggong or Sungei Siput, let alone in a Southern town eating in a diner with truckers!!

        Balas
    • 49. OverseasBumi  |  Julai 23, 2012 at 1:38 am

      I wrote about the phenomenon of fair skin privilege and discrimination against darker skinned people in several posts over the course of nearly a year. However, I think Helen and many readers tend to downplay it or ignore it.

      If you want to read more about this issue, see ‘colorism’

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination_based_on_skin_color

      I also wrote about the way the professional world and society at large diminishes and downgrades the contribution of women. The discrimination against women has been and continues to be a serious issue.

      I don’t need to be a woman to understand and acknowledge female discrimination. I just need to have a little empathy and keen observation to notice that women are sidelined even when they merit better professional recognition and equity.

      Some countries enforce positive discrimination/ affirmative action to help women achieve higher positions at the job place. They even have quotas. Norway requires board rooms to have 40% women:
      http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/jul/18/diversity-boardroom-corporate-decisions

      I recall Helen sidetracking and blogging about the stereotypical ‘female’ topic of ‘housekeeping’ when I raised the comparison between sexism and skin-color based discrimination, both of which are based upon generally immutable personal characteristics. I don’t think she wants to see the parallels.

      Helen is still against NEP. She has stated that before, and knowing how she always claims to be ‘consistent’, it is unlikely she will change her stance.

      It is this same stubbornness and unwillingness to admit one’s mistake or weakness or change one’s views that is very stereotypically Malaysian Chinese. The CORE of DAPSTER ideology is to never give in. In that sense, Helen is not much different from her vowed enemies.

      Don’t get me wrong. She is still far better than your run-of-the-mill malaysian chinese, whom I encounter overseas. Many I meet think that their perceived misfortunes are still due to NEP. Yet their short-sightedness or deliberate ignorance overlooks the fact they occupy a privileged section of society.

      Think about the time you heard a man complain about how a woman got a job / position that should have been for a man. Think about the time you heard about a well-to-do businessman complain about how he pays too much taxes. Think about the time you heard a beautiful lady complain about her rich/handsome bf not giving her enough attention.

      The above are all cases of people who occupy privileged positions in society but choose to ignore their good fortune.

      As for the use of “Allah” in the bible– yes, I do encounter arabs in this part of the world who think it is ok to use it. But you have to understand the context. This is a region where the two religions grew together side by side. The word is generally used differently here.

      I wish you had been with me when I attended an iftar at an egyptian muslim’s place attended by a diverse group of people. There were a few conservative americans and a few europeans. It was interesting to hear the americans espouse their conservative views. We got into quite a debate.

      Funny how the German in our party, an atheist, felt he didn’t have to argue these issues of religion. He felt he was ‘above it all’.

      One last thing, Helen. Freemalaysiatoday apparently issued an apology against Lynas. They admitted they were wrong in the Lynas debate. Science and reason prevails! I still haven’t heard you change your stance on Lynas?

      Balas
      • 50. Helen Ang  |  Julai 23, 2012 at 2:00 am

        Look, I can see that NEP was needed earlier. I’ve already said before (it was either in reply to you or to Anon) that if DAP had successfully taken S’gor in 1969, Malays back then would have met the fate of Kg Buah Pala(s). Even today we can see the monopoly in S’gor Times & the developer BFFs in Pg.

        I also support affirmative action for (i.e. looking specifically into the plight of) marginalized Indians for the present time. However, I do not wish these kind of programmes to be institutionalized as a Special Right & for quotas to be kept for perpetuity.

        I do not agree to the giving of benefits as privilege of birthright based on bumi status (i.e. two-tier citizenship) but I will allow that looking at the way Chinese have not integrated, it’s understandable why some still view us as pendatang.

        As for Lynas, have already said my science is not good enough and I do not have strong opinions on the issue, hence no Lynas postings as a topic.

        Lastly just out of curiosity, it is more difficult to puasa in a humid country like M’sia or a hot, dry (I’m presuming) country like UAE? You’re in an air-con environment the entire day?

        Balas
      • 51. OverseasBumi  |  Julai 23, 2012 at 3:04 am

        You usually respond so late at night?

        Actually it’s extremely hot and humid here. The combination of high heat and high relative humidity is what makes it dangerous. The phenomenon is called ‘felt air temperature’ and is scientifically described in the ‘heat index’.

        According to the heat index, if the thermometer reads 36 degC and the hygrometer 75% RH, you’d feel like it is 55 degC.

        The temperature hit 47 degC a few days ago.

        I rarely step out of the air conditioned office, and when I do, my glasses fog up instantly due to the high humidity.

        I played golf a few nights ago before ramadan, and it was about 40degC. I played from 8 to 10pm, and I felt my heart work harder to pump my thicker blood (due to fluid loss).

        We are advised to constantly check the color of our urine to ensure we are properly hydrated.

        So, yes, it is harder to puasa here.

        As for “two-tier citizenship”, I blame the malaysian chinese leaders and their media for drumming up this issue over the years– first among their own households and communities and now openly in the public.

        I think the use of the term ‘two-tier citizenship’ is in itself rather hyperbolic. As I said, the way we frame the issue colors and influences it. It’s like saying women have ‘penis envy’ to diminish their legitimate claim for gender equality.

        You didn’t answer me your view about affirmative action for women. As a woman, do you think it is justified?
        _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

        It’s 3.20am M’sian time. Am not gonna think. Going to bed soon. — Helen

        Balas
  • 52. pakard  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 2:52 pm

    Salam dek Helen,

    Ada yang memberikan perangkaan hasil bancian penduduk mengikut pecahan agama dianuti. Ia menjurus kepada kaum Cina dan agama Kristian. Pak Ard bertanya beberapa orang rakan Cina Kristian adakah mereka memberi maklumat betul tentang agama sewaktu dibanci atau di lain-lain keadaan. Jawapan mereka adalah tidak tentu, selalunya mereka mengaku kekal agama asal kerana masih baru bertukar ke Kristian.

    Tanyakan pada yang muda, jawapnya mereka tidak mahu melukakan hati orang tua. Ini juga berlaku pada kaum India. Jadi perangkaan dari hasil banci penduduk berkaitan agama yang dianuti tidak dapat Pak Ard terima sebagai tepat.

    Pengunaan perkataan “Allah” dapat dirasa niatnya. Kita boleh berhujah soal perundangan, soal sejarah dan peibagai lagi. Lalu kita petik fakta dari sana-sini. Pak Ard akan tanya diri sendiri, niat sebenarnya apa? Kenapa sebilangan penganut Kristian memperjuangkan sangat kalimah “Allah” untuk digunakan dalam kitab mereka?

    Pak Ard rasa mustahil penganut Hindu atau Budha hendak guna perkataan “Allah” untuk tuhan mereka, mereka akan bermati-matian membantah jika dipaksa berbuat begitu.

    Kononnya agama Sikh juga menggunakkan perkataan “Allah”, Pak Ard tidak tahu kesahihannya, tetapi belum ada rumah ibadat orang Sikh dibakar oleh orang Islam, kenapa? Jadi janganlah libatkan kaum Sikh dalam pertelingkahan ini.

    Pak Ard tidak membantah kitab Injil diterbitkan dalam Bahasa Melayu kerana kedudukan bahasa itu sebagai bahasa kebangsaan di sebuah negara di mana sebahagian warganya penganut Kristian. Pak Ard bantah penggunaan “Allah” dalam kitab injil kerana niatnya hendak menyamakan dengan agama Islam. Ia akan mengelirukan orang bukan Islam yang baru ingin mengenali agama Islam dan Kristian, mereka akan menganggap ianya sama.

    Pendakwah songsang Kristian akan menambat hati mereka dengan menawarkan pekej menarik tanpa perlu mengikut sebarang hukum agama Kristian kerana tujuan dakwah mereka berbeza. Mereka akan mengatakan penghujung tetap sama iaitu menyembah Allah.

    Dakwah Islam adalah menyampaikan, kemudian jika ada menerima, dianya akan diperingatkan dengan segala hukum-hakam dan peraturan, jika kekal yakin dan setuju maka Islamlah dia. Di situ titik kebebasan untuk memilih kerana sesudah memilih maka perlu patuh kepada segala hukum yang ditetapkan.

    Berbeza dengan dakwah songsang Kristian, mereka memancing dalam segala bentuk, wang ringgit, hiburan, wanita dan lain-lain. Tujuan mereka cuma hendak memesong seseorang itu dari agama asal, tidak perlu untuk menjadi Kristian yang baik apatah lagi mematuhi hukum agama tersebut cukup sekadar mengaku Kristian akan dapatlah segala habuan.

    Pengakuan itu membawa maksud meninggalkan agama asal dan ianya dilakukan bagi melemahkan agama lain. Ia menyerang masyarakat dunia. Tidak hairan sekarang mereka menggunakan hiburan bagi memancing golongan muda. Cara dakyah sebegini adalah penipuan dan berniat jahat.

    Adakah “pendakwah-pendakwah” ini benar-benar Kristian atau mereka yang tidak percayakan agama mempergunakan agama Kristian untuk tujuan tertentu?

    Akhir kata sempena bulan puasa, selamat berpuasa buat umat Islam. Pak Ard tidak hentikan kegiatan lain dan fokus kepada puasa dan ibadah khusus sahaja kerana Islam yang Pak Ard percaya tidak mengasingkan ritual dan kegiatan harian. Pak Ard juga tidak mahu salah faham bahawa lepas bulan puasa bolehlah buat maksiat dan dosa. Islam adalah cara hidup bukan amalan ritual-ritual tertentu sahaja. Sekian.

    Balas
  • 53. shamshul anuar  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 3:35 pm

    Tok rojak,

    This clash (Malay-Chinese) is unavoidable should both communities tolerate extremism within each communities.

    Make no mistake about it. I am not being pessimistic on it. Rather, I believe for so long, we take things for granted. That it will never happen.

    But the sign is there for all to see. The goodwill is depleting. DAP, in its ambition to perpetuate LIM DYNASTY gambles Chinese interest by attacking Malays and whatever their aspirations.

    Its “forte” is simple. Paint anyone defending Malays as racist. Try its best to “separate’ children at tender age so that they will not know each other. And suspicion breeds here.

    Cry out loud about Chinese being 2nd class and incites people not be grateful. Insist that “allah’ be used by christians although the word does not appear in numerous pages of Bible even once. Refuse to accept that the word is about foundation of Islam but insist to look it from language angle.

    Make difficult for Malays to own houses in Penang by overlooking low and medium cost houses. Instead give priority to luxury houses to be bought by investors from Taiwan, Hong Kong.

    Demolish hawker stalls on ground of disrupting traffic or hygiene but that limited to Malay stalls only. Insist on creating university in Malay kampong. And build largest Chinese cemetary right in middle of Malay reserve land.

    Relentless in attacking UMNO for being dominant in BN but is silent about DAP controlling PR. Reject Penang port privatisation on ground that Syed Mokhtar is outsider (simply because he is a Malay) but overlooks elephant in own house: Guan Eng is not from Penang. The worst and funny part is that Penang port is not “owned” by Penang state govt.

    Preach to others on morality but refuse to answer a very simple question on “alleged” affair. Put a racial flavour in own speech yet call BN MP as racist for asking why Ambiga not tried for treason.

    ONLY MORONS will still believe them.

    Balas
  • 54. Tok Rojak  |  Julai 21, 2012 at 8:52 pm

    Shamsul, I started replying point for point and I think I ended up with a mouthful that I personally felt was irrelevant to what I wanted to say.

    Most importantly (concised reply) is this:

    1. Malaysian Chinese has evolved to a point that their kinsmen in China, Hong Kong & Taiwan find us “odd.” We are much more polite, talk in more quieter tones etc (except for the extreme examples of that biadap fellow) – ie. we have adopted many Malay adats & culture. I still place my hands out when I need to cross between two persons even when I travel overseas or in the office.

    2. Of course we will continue to have discord because that is what being human is all about – don’t even speak about the Malay-Chinese thing, we haven’t even added the Indian equation. Even we fight among our own.

    3. Politicians are the same on both sides of the spectrum. They try to “goreng” us between rhetorics, polemics & sweet talk. Like I said, someone needs to be the victim, while one plays villian and the other the hero. This can be inter-change depending on the outcome of each elections.

    In this political intrigue, the weapon of name calling & labeling suits best to weaken the opposite party – “chauvinist”, “racist”, “bigot”,
    “communist”, “Cina kui” or the specific use of the suffix “kui” to stick to our next victim.

    4. I once met a taxi driver that told me that he applied 3 times to get a PKNS rumah pangsa but was rejected on the count that he was a PAS member under the rule of Khir Toyo. If we keep pushing him, what do you think will happen to him? A desire to see a heavenly vision in the midst of an earthly rule?

    My answer to him… saya Kelas II. No qualms about my reply since nothing given, nothing expected. But please read Haris Ibrahim latest encounter with PJ taxi drivers. Bukan UMNO, tidak ada lesen. Degil, biar sengsara.

    One should travel in the Malay heartlands, orang asli villages, Indian estates, ride up the Rejang & Baram rivers to understand the disparity between the modern “Bangsar” type & the other guy living on the otherside of the fence. You will be shocked of the “other” Malaysian living standards. It isn’t the smiling faces and dancing “natives” of our cuti2 1Malaysia adverts. Well, I can tell you that taxi driver’s son or daughter isn’t going to be Oxbridge trained. The system only works for a certain elite class. So for DAP, PKR, PAS, MCA or UMNO, pisang dibelah dua (same2)…. son or daughter will follow in the parents footsteps…. Big Lim, small Lim; Big Anwar, small Nurul; Big Tun M, small M; Grumpy Karpal, sauve G.

    Sorry PR isn’t going to be our utopic messiah either.

    Yes, sad to say, we are the morons that believe them. The years of myth-building… siapa menjadi hantu dan siapa menjadi pewira will keep us going while we discard the true concepts of muhibbah and nation building. Our saddest part is that East Malaysians/Orang Asli dah jadi Kelas III.

    PS. I appreciate your frank comments including people like Pak Ard. As long as we keep thinking through the issues minus the bullshit, we may get somewhere someday.

    Balas
  • 55. shamshul anuar  |  Julai 22, 2012 at 12:31 am

    Pak ard,

    Perkara yang boleh mengelirukan akhirnya AKAN MENGELIRUKAN.

    “allah” ialah perkara berkaitan aqidah. Ianya bukan perkara berkaitan perbezaan bahasa. Di belakang nama “allah” ialah soal aqidah.

    Membenarkan Kiristian guna nama yang sama bermakna membenarkam musibah berlaku.

    “nama Tuhan pun sama. Jadi samalah ugama kita. Tak ada beza kristian dengan islam”. Mungkin satu hari paderi Kristian akan berkata demikian. Dan jika saya boleh terfikir seorang paderi boleh berkata demikian, maka perkara itu boleh berlaku. DAN AKAN BERLAKU.

    Ini mendorong kearah Syirik, satu dosa yang tiada ampun.

    Bukankah kita umat Islam sudah diingatkan dalam Quran “…..bahawa mu tidak menyembah apa yang aku sembah. Bagiku ugamaku, Bagimu ugamamu’.

    Balas
  • 56. Tok Rojak  |  Julai 22, 2012 at 6:28 pm

    “The Rukunegara or sometimes Rukun Negara (Malay for “National Principles”) is the Malaysian declaration of national philosophy instituted by royal proclamation on Merdeka Day, 1970, in reaction to a serious race riot known as the May 13 Incident which occurred in 1969. The incident proved at that time that Malaysian racial balance and stability was fragile at best. Immediately thereafter, the Malaysian government sought ways to foster unity among Malaysians. One of the methods used to encourage unity is the Rukunegara.” Extracted from Wikipedia.

    “President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono is reported by the Jakarta Post as saying that abandoning the Pancasila state ideology for narrow religious or ethnic-based ideologies will only jeopardize the unity and diversity of the nation. In a speech to commemorate the founding of Pancasila on Thursday, Yudhoyono said the ideology was not an absolute doctrine but a compromise reached by the nation’s founding fathers, who had realized that Indonesia was a country made up of people from many faiths and ethnic groups.” http://www.indonesiamatters.com/408/pancasila/

    The Rukun Negara fashioned similar to Indonesia’s Pancasila had the same national purposes and agenda – to foster unity.

    But reading the Wikipedia entry on Rukun Negara, one seems to have a picture of one trying to put back the genie into the bottle.

    Unfortunately, in the last 15-20 years, most especially the last 10, there are several parties that may wish to release the genie to make the last wish (to gain power or to keep it?). I’ve always argued that politics for the sake of politics, many may say something that cannot be retracted. Therefore, we hope that we do not take misteps as a community and nation. We also hope nobody tries to look into the mirror and seek to be the fairest in the land – we know how the plot ends – distasterously.

    “The politics of hate and blame cannot go on forever and any party hoping to do well in the next general election will have to convince voters that it can offer the politics of hope.” – Joceline Tan

    “People voted for me on that basis, that I’m on bread and butter issues, not on tribal issues. And I think politicians do have to take note of that” – Irish legislator.

    Balas

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