Reuters had this story yesterday, ‘Malaysia government losing Chinese support’:
“The trend risks deepening racial fault lines if, as some analysts expect, the lead party in the coalition, Umno effectively ‘gives up’ on the Chinese vote and focuses on championing Malay rights to secure support in rural areas.”
I wrote along the same track too in my FMT article yesterday saying, “Post GE, the establishment will be decidedly Malay and the opposition Chinese-dominated”.
Reuters pointed out that “Najib has tried to unite the country with a highly touted program called ‘1Malaysia’.”
Here’s how the Malaysian Firstest politician greeted Najib’s programme. She is reported in Harakah — like spam, she’s … EVERYWHERE! … in the media (there’s simply no getting away from her).
According to the Harakah article titled, ‘1Malaysia in BN logo: ‘It’s no more national unity’.
“Ridiculing the move [to incorporate elements of the 1Malaysia artwork into the BN logo], Hannah said it … smacked of hypocrisy and would enable BN to spread its political propaganda to the schools …”
The “popular Adun” – Harakah‘s description of her – slammed 1Malaysia as being mere “political slogan”.
She ridicules 1Malaysia but proposes her own version of Anak Malaysia. Even her newborn baby must be put under the glare of political publicity.
She ridicules Najib but nonetheless persists in pestering him endlessly to get her own way despite the existing rules and regulations at the National Registration Department.
What is Umno to think about the Chinese votes? Does The Star have any clue?
The Reuters story had this to add: “MCA leader Chua Soi Lek acknowledged the party leadership had been too ‘low profile’.”
Tahu pun. Yah lor, the party leadership had been too ‘low profile’. I blogged about it in ‘The ‘size of balls’ no joke with MCA’ which provides an explanation as to why the leadership had been too ‘low profile’.
I log on to the MCA party website to read and the leadership does have some cogent things to say.
But as my posting on the ‘size of balls’ explains, the Gunting Dalam Lipatan selalu dok snip-snip-snip so that its coverage of the MCA men – the paper’s coverage of Wanita MCA and Beliawanis is scantier than a stripper’s costume, i.e. very little – diminishes the value of what they’re saying.
Whereas what the DAPSters want to hear and are ever ready to lap up is now the choir of sweet angels going kissy-kissy …
Nga Kor Ming who said, “All Malaysians are my brothers and sisters including Dr Zambry”.
Ng Wei Aik who said: “Marilah kita bersama-sama hidup dalam negeri ini dengan suasana muhibah, kasih sayang dan semangat kekeluargaan yang tinggi.”
Lim Guan Eng who said: “Let us embrace the future by embracing every Malay, Indian, Chinese, Kadazan and Iban, as Malaysian brothers and sisters, Malaysian sons and daughters.”
And of course all the stuff that Hannah has been saying in her Occupy Masjid campaign, so much so that even Harakah is giving her Selangor Times level promo.
81 thoughts on “Umno gives up on Chinese vote”
Typical chings,in business they monopolise everything,they form cartel to control and manipulate things,when they feel they are strong they want to rule the country.We Malays who witness May 13 will never forget hoe we were humiliated by you and we will will never forget our brothers who murdered by you lot.Hidup Perkasan,Hidup UMNO.
Don’t harp on Chinese votes this time around. Things have changed so much since election 2008. Before that, there was no alternative coalition to challenge the BN.
DAP is one ethnic party, PAs is one ethnic party, and PKR is a party of sorts. Then came Pakatan after the unprecedented 2008 election. For once, the Chinese saw an alternative coalition; and not only an alternative coaltion, but a coaltion where they could see real chances of an alternative to the BN.
Obviously, one could cite Gagasan Rakyat and APU during the time when Semangat 46 was all ex-UMNOs. But this was no alternative. Rather, the Chinese were suspicious of this set-up so much that they dumped LKS and Karpal from becoming MPs. Yes, the Chinese already knew Pakatan is not going to win GE13. But this is not the point. The point is to be able to bargain their position after GE13, when PAS and PKR have become a spent force.
Surely, DAP is going to win another 4 -5 parliamentary seats in Sarawak although they may lose Sibu. In Semenanjung, MCA big guns may also fall, although Malay seats won by PAS and PKR are likely to return to UMNO and BN. Pribumi? Well, for now, they are with BN. The Sarawak state election tells it all.
DAP and Pakatan went all out for the pribumi votes, harping substantively on the Bible issue. Yet, the pribumis were not convinced. Pakatan were so excited with the Sarawak state election that they forgot it was a yardstick for the general election. And now they know. BN can bank on the Sarawak votes, minus the Chinese votes, of course. Pakatan and DAP can no longer play the Bible issue.
In fact, there’s no issue to harp on. They’ve all been played out. Nothing is left.
I will have a laugh when Hannah Yeoh loses Subang Jaya to an Indian independent…
I bet she doesn’t mind if that Indian is her husband! Wakaka
Yeah right… Mr R is merely there to adorn Puan Besar’s arm.
I guess that’s what happens when you are married to a political wife. I symphatise her husband, Mr Hannah Yeoh. He had to work and serve his wife as a chancellor. His daughter is not Indian but classified as Chinese. He will probably lose his religion too as Hannah is a devout Christian. Shame when you see a man loses everything including his dignity. I do hope that there will be a candidate to take her on as Adun of Subang Jaya and whoever he/she is, will get my vote. No second thoughts.
I still wonder this can be true… But again, we for sure knows the answer. The Malaysia we knew is never the same post 2008. BUT tainted and tarnished image of Pakatan leaders could also make a little change.
Pakatan is just as worse as Barisan, if not more. They never been into power and once they ‘feel’ the nikmat of becoming someone in power, they start thinking they own the world and that whatever they think are so much valuable and their decrees are to be obeyed. Be them PAS or DAP. I dont mention PKR since we all know what sort they are made of.
I for once, want to see whether 2012 GE will see survival of malaysia or not. If UMNO can make government solely on their seats and intertwined fate that PAS support it, UMNO can totally upheld the constitution and abandoning championing other races interest.
I felt disheartened and distanced when the government that i vote did not trying to protect or give me more benefits. They want to champion the chinese and indian hearts which they knew did not support them.
I am not being racist here, i am just like other malays who were sad with the development in Malaysia.
Replying on the iphone, painfully typing on the small screen and misreading, ‘he/we’ and at the same time answering questions in spanish with some germans – cant help but using broken with plenty of grammatical errors.
Ed, Balearic Islands, Spain, you say “I felt disheartened and distanced when the government that I vote did not trying to protect or give me more benefits (sorry yeah!!!! blame it on the Non- Malay for a Malay who needs to find a living in hither land).
Then you say, “They want to champion the chinese and indian hearts which they knew did not support them”. Really after 57 years!!!! Then the disclaimer ” I am not being racist here, i am just like other malays (like how you would decide for the Malays in Malaysia sitting in Spain like a remote control) who were sad with the development in Malaysia”.
How is Spain treating you? Are you really concern about you or what is happening for those in M’sia. Wah iphone mah!!!, me still using the analogue Nokia. progress kononnya. Nothing personal just that I find it kelakar with your comment.
Ed belearic is being true to himself and express hismelf..regardless whether it made you laugh or not is irrelevant unlike some dishwasher apek who try to impose his liberal everyone is anglophile ideology.
Unlike chinese anglophiles like you who stil think malays are bad in maths and like chopping hands, there are many malay diaspora who excel and work abroad successfully but cannot work in malaysia private sector as they are sabotaged by chinese anglophiles such as getting lower pay than chinese, difficult to get promotion while the public sector and glc do not pay them high enough to retain them in malaysia, my uncle is a it security specialist with UBS bank in zurich is one of them and he also says that when he worked on the mykad project he see chinese executives with no clue in Java are catapulted into project leader positions yet employed by the government as experts while real pros like my uncle become mere consultant, after the mykad security source codes were completed he returned to zurich where he is now a specialist…
true to ed in spain, the malaysian government has indeed pampered the elite chinese who cascaded their wealth to their exclusively chinese executives under the guise of meritocracy…but stay silent when chinese board of directors are catapultaed into petronas and GLCs without merit and experience because foolish najib wants to appease the cina merajuk…
silterra is a good example which employed a chinese MD that almost broke the company but recovered when a malay MD was recruited from freescale..if silterra become bankrupt under malay MD sure the chinese will brag how stupid the malays are…such are the libels that chinese toss freely at malays..hence mi dia sagre that the malays like to chinese names as helen claim..it is vice versa….when malays express injustice in the private sector or discrimination they face from the chinese he is racist..when chinese bitch about not getting public sector jobs, not getting the university of his choice..he is righteous…you will be surprise that the chinese anglophile that bitch a lot have good jobs with higher pay scale while the malay overseas graduates that they envy slog longer hours work to get a mere 4 percent pay rise..
even those in the glc like petronas work very hard and dont go on vacations in the first years in their job while chinese engineering graduates who work selling insurance in chinese-owned bank or as an executive in a MNC dominated by chinese suka hati take 2 weeks leave on CNY and even Raya and pass their tasks to malay counterparts…its time the malays stop being apologetic..lets tell our sad stories too and be righteous for once.
Q. Any idea why “Chinese engineering graduates work selling insurance in Chinese-owned bank” & not employed in the field that they qualified academically in? — Helen
I agree with forrestcat on the point that people are quick to use their ethnicity as the first excuse for anything under the sun.
There ARE a lot of unqualified people sitting in positions beyond their capacity from all races, Malays, Chinese, Indians what not you. The real problem wasn’t social engineering, the issue is related to patronage economics where people (regardless of their skin colour) were put there due to cronyistic tendencies.
I can vouch for the “puja” consultant mentality among the elites. Home grown talents cannot get anywhere without proper cables, and in most cases, a good cable can see totally inept people landing positions with huge responsibilities. I have been to enough sessions where any ang moh will automatically be embraced as the expert by the authorities, although the same ang moh would have to consult local experts to “gather” intelligence.
The solutions by all these helicoptered experts, regardless of their skin colour, sometimes end up in the clouds – millions spent, but impact = zero.
hear ye forrestcat
sad but true
Not blaming, but surely a true situation. Umno been allocating a lot of money for vernacular school come election, or other matter specifically on concerns to one particular race but Malay. Tell me thses are not true!
On the other hand, malay interest would be championed mostly by perkasa. When the chinese demanded something and fulfilled, some of perkasa demands only sift thru fingers.
Doesnt matter where i reside, Malaysia is my home :-)
Beside, i still pay Malaysian taxes and keeping my properties there.
To answer ur question: I felt concerned for myself and for my family in Malaysia. Short and simple. (euro is collapsing, might want to take the business back to malaysia)
To as you one question: did the malays ever asked or took anything belong to the chinese and indian? Citizenship, scholarship, the land rights, economy? But it was us the malays, that share this land country by giving the citizenship (which otherwise the immigrants would become the subject of British Protectorate). It was the history… That we malays have been kind, and TOO generous.
Spain can be rough and unforgiving and their bureaucracy can be ridiculous, but they would rather protect their ‘catalonian’ people than giving up to the ‘pendatang’ like me. I dont complain as long as my business is doing good or i would be demanding so much more
And mind you, i do vote. I paid for the flight ticket and get a short holiday in Malaysia. That was in 2008 when i finally have the chance to vote.
P/s: iphone or nokia, still not as good as sitting infront of computer and typing replies for hours :-) my fingers are too big for the small screen and the typing process is too slow compared to what my brain is processing. Hate that but love the technology.
Well said, Ed. Just ignore those from so-called USA. If anyone want to have a say on how to develop this nation, they have to come and live here in Malaysia otherwise, stay out of it. We don’t need remote-controlled ideas.
There u go again, u just can’t have people having their own opinion re u..wats your problem….relax la wak ….
The fact is if Umno were to win on the Malay,Sabah n Sarawak it gonna very difficult for PM of the day to ignore the Ultra Malays and demand from Sabah and Sarawak.
Me I’m going to be a very satisfied Ultra Melayu.The Chinese will just have to bite their finger and ponder what or where did it go wrong….heh…heh…padan muka…
NadZree, kawan, jangan tension. Who am I do dictate? UMNO wins or PR wins is not the issue,but rakyat sekalian kena menang bro tanpa mengira asal. Menang ini bukan setakat apa yang parti perlu tapi kehendak sesama sendiri apa yang patut dikalangan kita sesama sendiri. Masalah saya ini, ingin rasa sebagai malaysian tapi kerana keadan pemikiran yang hanya mementingkan parti politik dan keagamaan untuk menepikan akhlak keperikamanusian menyinggungkan saya. Tanpa keperikamanusian tak ada akidah, betul tak ?
Saudara nie kadang kadang melucukan, saudara bertanya who m i to dictate?
Memang la ta boleh, tapi maksud saya harus ke memperkecilkan pendapat serta persekitaran mereka yang pandangan berbedza dari saudara itu saja.
MCA should do the right thing and exit BN. By not exiting BN, the Chinese see it as a crony party of UMNO willing to condone the pillaging of the country by its Melayu partner. How long will you tolerate the raping and pillaging that it is going on in the name of race and religion ?
It is very important that MCA do NOT exit BN. The fallacy has been repeated not only by DAPsters, but by a lot of senseless Malaysians. We need TWO equally viable multiracial coalitions who take the middle path of moderation, differentiated only in their ability to deliver good governance.
Only very short sighted people will promote MIC, MCA or Gerakan to leave BN to the ultras.
How I wish you are the president of MCA.
Godfather, everything is not politics.The MCA does not need to exit BN.The Malays are the best people that you can have as your partners to execute what is humane. You will never find anyone more humane than the Malays like the Indians and the original Chinese.
Please run your agenda somewhere else.The race and religion today is an agenda of the Anglophile Chinese not the Malaysians per se. Take your battle elsewhere, for Malaysians are confluence of humanity without the dogmatic practice of religion or how it should dictate us when humanity is paramount when we deal with one another irrespective of our race or religion.
Godfather, you mean MCA should join DAP in pillaging the country instead? Like how the DAP is pillaging Selangor and Penang? The DAP even in their short stint of governing Perak also managed to pillage the state. First, of course they need a plient puppet Mentri Besar like Nizar. Then, get MB to award all land to cronies (999 year lease) and award contracts to cronies, like the state assembly uniform contract.
Yeah, how long are we going to tolerate these raping and pillaging? If Pakatan Rakyat were to become the federal goverment, I bet the magnitude of pillaging shall be even BIGGER!!!!!!!
pkns football field fiasco. sale of prime land below value, conversion of land meant for recreations, tailorgate just days into power
Rakyat tak takut ke?
Despite attempt by Najib to woo the Chinese, the community continues to give mixed signal. Meaning they all smiles when photographed with Najib handing a mocked cheques to Chinese school and at a same time put their faith to DAP.
That is their choice, The problem is that the party that that they put faith on is maintaining an anti Malay attitude. what the chinese generally overlook the fact is that they are the loser themselves by soliciting with DAP.
The sarawak CM learned the hard way. Donating acres of land to Chinese school does not guarantee votes. Yes. they will take it but still complaining that they “feel” like second class citizens.
Second class means that they do not dominate the govt sector the way they dominate private sector.
Najib may not want to accept the fact that goodwill is waning on Malay sides. They are asking why must a chinese politician represents a malay majority area.
With due respect to Chinese, one thing bad about the community( no offense intended) is that it never gives hoots on aspiration of other communities. At least that is the perception of other communities about the Chinese.
And I can vouch how rampant the discrimination againsts non chinese in private sector. But do not expect to read about it in Nanyang siang Pau or STAR.
Okay, I can understand Malay patience running thin to see the BN/govt overtures being rebuffed, which is the sentiment ‘Ed, Balearic Islands’ was trying to convey, I believe — diberi madu, dibalas tuba.
But do you think there is any other reason for these attempts by Najib to woo the Chinese, besides the obvious vote-fishing? (I keep hearing that racial tensions are high.)
Helen, thank you for mentioning me by name! That’s an awful lot as it seems my post is being ‘picked’ up.
It never stop to mesmerize me that the Malay with their ‘tak kisah’ attitude and ‘ok, we’ll give you more’ were never been thanked.
Take for instance, the constitution says that every 1 public-service post created for non-Malay, 4 same post have to be created for Malays. As Malays make up more than 55% of populations, I think it is fair that 5 from every 10 scholarship recipient go to the Malays.
When NEP was introduced, instead of “thanking” the government, the Chinese went mad because they see the Malay are accumulating wealth and asking for abandoning the policy. But what happened behind that policy? Government did not take the wealth from the Chinese to give it to the bumiputera, but by “creating” more wealth that the Chinese accumulation grows even faster and bigger than what government had anticipated. But, pardon me for this word, ‘hati busuk’ made a lot of people to abandon the working policy so they can bolot for themselves. AND, unfortunately some Malays are even tuning for the same song, after they became rich and fat and even fatter showered with wealth.
Call me racist or any label you like (even the Malays been calling me that), but by asking WAY for more (just so the Chinese can bargain: because they know the government will at least agree to some), they are just IMPOLITELY hurting us the Malays.
I do not see any sign JUST YET in Malaysia saying: ‘Malays should buy Malays First’ or ‘Malays should stop buying from non-Malays’ – which I dont think can happen anyway considering that historically, Malays can never be united – but if it happen, then Malaysia will be in a very deep trouble. Ethnic segregation will take place and if the Second 13th May ever occurred, the momentum will exert more power than we can imagine before: Just think how many of Malays in Penang or more in the rural who live among big houses belongs to the Chinese have been in jealousy with them?
Call me racist? My staff are composed of multiple ethnics that can hang out and chill and laugh, which I wonder if i can see this in Malaysia if i ever took the business back ‘TO HOME’!
And Najib, stop fooling around. If the Chinese want to be segregated, let them be. Unite the Malays! Because I think despite any songs being sung by the opposition, GE13 is Malays vs Chinese.
Nothing personal Helen, but we have to face the reality. For how long we can play bitter-smile and cheese-smile and one day no more smile?
Can you PLEASE tell me where does the Constitution said what YOU said?
“Take for instance, the constitution says that every 1 public-service post created for non-Malay, 4 same post have to be created for Malays. As Malays make up more than 55% of populations, I think it is fair that 5 from every 10 scholarship recipient go to the Malays.”
I don’t know how many more such claims I can take. Are you referring to the Malaysian Constitution, by any chance?
Btw, please give out scholarships on the basis of either a combination of merit and social background or some indicator of relevance, but not race please.
And on a technicality Ed, there are also supposed to be more Malay rapists, robbers, crooks, beggars, drug addicts, prostitutes and pirated VCD or DVD sellers just as they should be more Malay millionaires, doctors, lawyers, architects, engineers. Laws of proportionate mathematics, ya know?
Bagai enau dalam belukar, melepaskan pucuk masing-masing.
Itu realiti communal-based politics. Each Malay/Chinese/Dayak/Indian/Kadazan/Bajau looking out for their own interests.
Hi “I hate N’Sync”,
You can read more about the quota here,
Then you have to read all the Articles of 153 and sub-articles with regards quotas. I took Third World Studies (just one paper for one semester in USM in 2003) and that was part of what we have debated. It is still in my brain because it was imprinted and the printed material sources, then have to wait until I get back to Malaysia, still keeping intact in my library.
“Btw, please give out scholarships on the basis of either a combination of merit and social background or some indicator of relevance, but not race please.”
In the early years PSD scholarship was given based on race, but nowadays it was given based on merits. You want to know the funny story? When chinese applied for PSD-S, and got rejected, they claim they are sided. When malays applied and got rejected, they only go to public universities. No bang bang… And when many Malays were given PSD-S based on merits, the Chinese said, why only Malays – which this time sounds more racist, they asked why the Chinese dont get quota.
When there’s was quota, they ask for meritocrasy. When meritocrasy was applied and many of malays being most of the creams, they want the quota. See the dilemma here? Malays are not stupid you know, they can fill the top what-ever list of meritocrasy too ;-)
Dear N’sync hater: I put specific reference to “Malays in Penang or more in the rural who live among big houses” which most of them are poor, living in improper housing and make the majority of the people. for the record, i did not deny there are MANY of Malay millionaires. No, what i saying is that, the grueling of “majority malay who are still poor and living among big car and big house belongs to chinese people”.
We can be emotional or sweep everything under the carpet or keep ourself in denial, but that will not help and the outburst will definitely make things go wrong.
Not for showing off, in the neighbourhood i live in penang, i am the only Malay. While i dont have any trouble, but my friends and family did and still do when they visit me while im in malaysia.
I do not think that there are hidden texts of the Constitution that are denied to the public. I am aware of the Malay and Bumiputera quota for civil service intake (kumpulan sokongan sahaja) during the early days of Malayanizing the public sector. However, they are not detailed or fleshed out under the Constitution per se, just like how Chinese vernacular schools are not specifically stated by the same document. Many things were left on the floor by the Reid Commission, like the periodic review for NEP. In any case, anyone from JPA today can tell you that it is no longer done or necessary, considering the Malays already make up the bulk. In fact, a reversed quota set for Indians were experimented recently.
I don’t know what they taught you in USM, but I supposed it was the same what they taught me at UPM.
I totally agree with you on the sentiments of the minority regarding the scholarships. That is why it is important for JPA and the civil service to be transparent and clear about the process. I believe in the need for reserved positions in IPTAs for the disadvantaged (who should be mostly Malays anyway), but don’t tar or stain all the Bumiputeras with the assistance. Many capable and brilliant Malaysians earned their entry into institutions of higher learning on their own right and this must be acknowledged and recognized. I am not concerned about more Malays getting scholarships, I am more concerned about whether the aid goes to deserving candidates, and not due to know-who factors. Same thing goes to the civil service, where a lot of hiring were made on the basis of who’s vetting the applictions, and I am talking about Malaysians (especially Malays and Bumiputeras), who were kept on contract for years despite excellent performance while others were hired on a permanent basis because of connections.
As for your experience in Penang, I think ethnic conclaves are the norm. We all live side by side other races, but in some areas, the more well to do tend to congregate and that’s where all the rich go, whether they are Eurasian, Chinese, Indian or Malay, the rich live by a separate set of rules.
I am not asking people to live in denial, but generalizations tend to distort the fact that there are a lot on poor non-Malays and many Malays live in big houses and drive expensive cars too. I thought the press has highlighted enough such Melayu Barus, including their very expensive sports cars and beautiful women.
I hate Nsync,
This is not race hate propagation column. If you are trying to find one, may I suggest you visit any site related to DAP.
Just because an entire community should not be punished because there is one bad employer( happened to be Chinese) who is cruel to her maid, SIMILARLY one community’s right should not be challenged because there are some rapists i n Malay community.
“…But please gives out scholarship….”
Again. It goes back to the eve of independence. Again I have to remind you that as the Lord of the Lands( Malay rulers) agreed to change the status of non Malays en bloc at that times from “immigrant” to “Citizens”,some provisions in RETURN are accorded to Malays.
It is written inj the Constitution , saying “keutamaan dari segi biasiswa…”
What I am trying to say is that it is not racist at all with regards to giving scholarships. I am all for giving scholarships to deserved students. But the fund is limited and let us face it never enough if you ask any student in this planet.
Many of my schoolmates got very good results in SPM and they also were not offered scholarships . It is not the end of the world.
What needed is explanation to them. Instead, some politicians go around instigating dejected parents that they( Chinese) are discriminated when it comes to scholarship.
Once I saw names of students granted scholarship by one newspaper. Out of 40 names, only 1 Malay was offered scholarship. But Malays do not make noises.
you did ask about the real discontentment that make Chinese rejected countless overtures by UMNO or Najib.
Chinese have some genuine criticisms, just like Malays. You may not want to hear this. But what I feel is that many are just plain “ungrateful”.
It is the attitude of people who thinks world revolves around them. It is the attitude what malays called as “tak tahu bersyukur” .
As for Najib, this is what Malays are saying about his wooing the Chinese community.”jangan sampai macam “hidung tak mancung pipi tersorong sorong”.
Meaning do not degrade your integrity while sourcing support. There is a limit to overtures. At a junction, the other party must at least show some appreciation.
By this point, you should realize that I have nothing against scholarships for the disadvantaged (read: Malay majority). We do need to close the gap between and within the races. It is PRECISELY because funding is limited, we must give scholarships to deserving students, from poor socioeconomic background who has the chance to make good of the opportunities given to them.
I have a friend from high school who came from FELDA plantations and he is now a successful second generation as professional media practitioner. Education is key to breaking the poverty cycle.
We must stop the opportunists from instigating the masses using half-truths and lies. So, it becomes imperative we be transparent, share information about the selection process and how many denied vs. how many successful and the cut-off points (i.e. the methodology). Then we can educate the masses at the same time about the work we are trying to achieve, AND NOT LET MISPERCEPTIONS CONTINUE about scholarships being given out on the basis of race alone. Some Yayasans and Foundations give out scholarships to certain ethnic groups only, we cannot control that or argue with provisions of the bodies, but we can do what is within our ability to correct sentiments of race bias, starting by having a clear process.
I could not agree more. And thanks for shedding the light on Constitution.
I also learned about the Constitution way back in 1987. It was shown that the quota for civil service is 4 out of 5. It is there.
It is time Chinese community stop thinking that they can ignore the multiracial composition of the land. It is time for Chinese community to stop sacrificing their own interests by supporting half baked Chinese politicians who are not fit to be their representative. Their modus operandi is to cry out loud for equal justice ( meaning let the Chinese control everything aspect of life) and accusing others( meaning Malay) as racist .
AND AT THE SAME TIME they simply refuse integration. They do not want the Chinese students in national schools , mixing with people of darker complexion.
IN SHORT, please stop behaving like “pendatang”.
By saying the harsh word of advice, I do not mean that chinese should not voice their legitimate interest. By all mean go on. But please do not be a hypocrite.
LIKE what? Like putting advertisement “mandarin is required” and at the same time wonder why Malays call their politicians as “pendatang”.
About those who like to call other people ‘racist’, it does not necessarily come from the Chinese but from those with a holier-than-thou ethos, who are over-compensating. See my experience with the Christianized Indians. — Helen
Why are there still people who want to put things into the Constitution when it is clearly not there?
Haven’t we been through this? Where is this special Constitution of yours that says in text that a Malay quota “4 out of 5” is set for civil service? Are some of you shown a special Constitution in lieu of your special positions?
it is ultra right wing people like you who need to “stop thinking that they can ignore the multiracial composition of the land”. folks like you are the ones who try to force race & religion down everyones throats, give white packets or serve beef to Hindus.. then claim ‘tak payah minta maaf & jaga sensitiviti mereka’ because they are minority (i actually read this from pro-racialist blog).
its ok if they are out of ignorance & with apology, but out of arrogance, that is another matters.
Dear I hate N’Sync,
“Why are there still people who want to put things into the Constitution when it is clearly not there?”
Constitution of Malaysia (MC) not a stone but rather living on its own. Every government (thus far only BN) has amended on the majority of the parliament. Please do read that NEP/DEB was established under the framework of MC, therefore the policy is thus to be read as an extension to the constitution ‘understanding’ – that is describing behaviour. Say for example, 153 says about Bumi Special Rights, but it did not explain “how and where”, thus DEB policy complement why explaining how (proactive measure) and where (economic policy).
The Tun Razak government announced the New Economic Policy (NEP) in 1971. Its stated goal was to “eventually eradicate poverty…irrespective of race” through a “rapidly expanding economy” which emphasized to increase the Malays’ share in the national economy to a reasonable portion between all the races. The NEP targeted a 30 per cent Malay share of the economy by 1990. The government contended that this would lead to a “just society” (“Masyarakat Adil”), the latter slogan being used to promote acceptance of the policy. Quotas in education and the civil service that the Constitution had explicitly provided for were expanded by the NEP, which also mandated government interference in the private sector. For instance, 30% of all shares in initial public offerings (IPOs) would be disbursed by the government to selective Bumiputras. The old civil service hiring quota of 4 Malays for every non-Malay was effectively disregarded in practice; between 1969 and 1973, 98% of all new government employees were Malay. Five new universities were opened under the NEP, two of which were explicitly targeted at the Malays and Muslims; at least one (Universiti Teknologi Mara) remains open only to Bumiputra as of 2006. 90% of government scholarships for studying abroad were awarded to Malays. Hiring quotas in the private sector were also enforced. Admission to Universities were reduced to allow more Malays to Universities and keep other races out. The NEP policy does mean to reduce other races economy, and to maintain that Malays remain the supreme race In Malaysia.
In the quote, clearly the policy exists before it was abolished and any policy by a ruling government, mind you, must conform to our MC.
You want to show that Shamsul and I as if we are too stupid and we would say anything just to make it sounds good, or in short you still have the mentality that other Chinese has ‘the Malays are stupid and would say anything to save their butt’.
PSD/JPA has been for the past few years applying meritocrasy – and when it does clearly, more Malays deserved and filling the top creams and Chinese doesnt feel satisfied. Why? Dont you think that JPA filtering committee would also consist of other races? Or you just cant accept that we Malays have brain too?
As an addition:
In the quote I put, since I would prefer to quote in full, please separate facts and fictions. Since the last few sentences look like asserting more of a fiction to me. The economic growth of Malaysia was very astounding and “reduce the other races economy” was rather blatant. You can only reduce, by taking “some” away. But the statistic in RM-5, 6, 7 and 8 shows that Chinese is majority owners of wealth in Malaysia.
Even if the last paragraph is true, the objective was rather doomed and failed. Because despite “having” the supremacy, the Malays are still lacked in so many ways. Therefore, the statement was rather paradoxical.
Wow, you are now telling me that our Constitution is a breathing living thing. Well, EACH AND EVERY AMENDMENT to the Constitution must be done through due processes of the law. The Constitution is a textual document. So every time some Tom Dick or Harry comes along and tell me this and that is in the Constitution, ALL WE HAVE TO DO IS CHECK WITH THE DOCUMENT.
Now, you are going on and on about the fact that the Constitution is just the kerangka or framework, where details will be fleshed out in Government policies and programs. I totally agree with that, just like Hudud’s relationship with the Quran. What I do contest is your argument that “any policy by a ruling government, mind you, must conform to our MC”.
Conformity to the Malaysian Constitution is highly debatable. How constitutional is the NEP itself is subjected to public opinion, especially when the policy was hijacked to enrich a select few. Don’t come in here and talk to me about policies of by the Government and their supposed automatic conformity to the MC. That’s a fallacy, you know it and I know it. It is convenient that the policies and programs are labelled as conforming to the spirit of the MC, but when the matter of performance and periodic reviews of NEP, Article 153 was brought out to silence all criticisms.
Who are you and Shamshul to the Malays? Why can’t you be too stupid? So if I call you both dumbasses I am calling all the Malays stupid? Wah, so you two represent all the Malays in this country-lah? For the record, I represent myself and not the Chinese Malaysians, just in case everyone thinks all of them are like me – brilliant. :P
I never doubted the Malays have brain, I am just doubting whether you (specifically you) are using your mental faculties when you claimed that the defunct civil service ratio for INTAKE of support level staff is, or ever was “IN THE CONSTITUTION”.
As for you trying to only accept quotes that will not run afoul your mental picture of the situation (i.e. statistics show that Chinese is majority owners of wealth in Malaysia), let me teach you a thing or two about statement precision, statistics and RMK reports. MAJORITY OWNERS OF WEALTH IN MALAYSIA means that collectively, all the Chinese in Malaysia owns wealth more than ALL THE WEALTH IN THE HANDS OF THE MALAYS. You name me any proxy measure to this supposed statistical indicator and I will tell you why you did not read or understood ANY of the RMK reports. I challenge you to name me where is such statement was implied that enabled you to quote
“But the statistic in RM-5, 6, 7 and 8 shows that Chinese is majority owners of wealth in Malaysia.”
Go do your linguistic gymnastics on “REDUCE” and larger share of a growing economic cake elsewhere. I shall address the paradox in Malay supremacy from the supposed bottom rung of the society the next time, if you have the stomach for it. Adios.
Good reply, but found it rather twisted. In MC, there was no direct reference to ‘one million cintizenship to be conferred to the chinese and indian immigrants’, but Reed put a statement, those immigrants who were born bla bla bla and jus soli. This is the framework, unless u want to say ur forefathers citizenship debatable as well, which will bring another matter, that we malays now can question your citizenship over how and why!
And the way you put ur question only shows how u think you and your chinese blood is so much superior and thank you for the lesson… I learnt many before and i dont think i will stop learning… But i myself being pendatang in spain, alas i felt how the pendatang in malaya felt. But i did not ask for jus soli like some few who cannot be thankful and i would say is now GREEDY!
Excuse me, the MC didn’t specify or say how many non-Malays were awarded citizenship because the people who drafted them were not clairvoryants. They did, like what they did to protect the special positions of the Malays and Bumiputera, outlined things that could be done reasonably in civil service, education and specific licenses where deemed fit by the King, just like how they outlined clearly the things that can strip away a person’s citizenship. The Constitution IS very clear on the conditions which a person can lose their citizenship 1) by REJECTING it or 2) STRIPPED because of foreign citizenship. Only naturalized citizens can be stripped of their citizenship due to disloyal behaviour, and those born in Malaysia are NOT naturalized citizens, but our birth right only to be lost by giving it up ourselves or acquiring a foreign citizenship.
I take it you are also going to take the easy way out by not substantiating your claim that the wealth of the land is concentrated in the hands of the Chinese in Malaysia. I was so hoping to share the official statistics of WHO is hoarding most of the wealth in this country, and fyi, it is not held by a particular ethnic group.
I am not superior because I am Chinese, I feel so insulted. I am remarkable because I use my brain and I check my sources. Oh, I am learning everyday too, there is just so much knowledge out there. I am just pointing out that one has to be responsible for the knowledge they claim to be the truth before spreading what turns out to be lies, slander and half-truths.
When will I stop being a pendatang? I didn’t migrate to Malaysia like you are a guest in Spain. I am born here, and I give what I can back to this country, I don’t siphon money off to a foreign account and I don’t send money back to anyone outside the country. This is my home too and this is where my roots are. I don’t feel like a pendatang UNLESS you are telling me that that’s how the Malays are treating the non-Malays – like the Spaniards treating immigrants like yourself. You don’t know how much of a slip you just made, revealing the true feelings of the average Malays towards the non-Malays. For you, all of us non-Malays just arrived on your shores yesterday, stealing your nasi lemak and roti canai, citizenship or not be damned.
The prejudice you held is not only telling, its damning.
No point talking about color of skin, or getting something at the expense of other’s race. Malaysians outside Malaysia only identify themselves as Malaysian and many of them prosper because of their own effort. What’s needed in this country is everyone’s effort to help move the country forward. Work with the government (state and federal) because they are elected by the people. During election, cry your lungs out during campaigning. After that, hold hands with the elected government and help the country move forward. The neighboring countries do not compete with BN or PR, they compete with Malaysia!!
Dengan melewatkan PRU 13, Adakah Najib masih mengharapkan dan memberikan masa untuk pengundi china berubah
Tapi sampai bilakah pintu ini akan terbuka dan bagaimanakah senario politik negara sekiranya Najib gagal dalam usahanya itu?
Apakah strategi UMNO dan dimanakah agaknya kedudukan MCA ketika itu ?
Saya fikir tidak. Masyarakat Cina telah dihasut oleh DAP bahawa mereka boleh berkuasa ( dengan meminggirkan Melayu). Orang cina barangkali terlupa bahawa kebnyastaan memerlukan mereka bekerjasama dengan orang Melayu.
Jika masyarakat Cina dalam pilihanraya akan datang terus mengundi DAP, maka orang Melayu akan berkata “padan muka Najib. ”
Taib Mahmud mungkin telah belajar betapa sia sia bermurah hati pada masyarakat Cina
Sebenarnya, masyarakat Cina diberitahu DAP bahawa mereka boleh berkuasa jika bekerjasama dengan Melayu bukan BN.
I hate N’Sync
Bukan perkongsian pemerintahan yang diidamkan oleh kaum Cina, itu telah mereka kecapi melalui BN.
Mereka sebenarnya di janjikan penghapusan hak keistimewaan orang Melayu..
Satu mimpi yang sungguh indah……
Terlalu indah hingga sanggup belot pada teman yang dulu sama sama cari makan……
Terlalu indah sehingga lupa untuk berpijak dialam nyata..
Terlalu indah hingga tidak memperduli kemungkinan yang menanti….
Orang Melayu dah lama main politik… dah sebati dalam jiwa dan roh mereka… Kita lihat dan tunggu selepas PRU13 ni, sapa yang lebih pandai main politik.!
Belajar lah sejarah konflik pribumi dan keturunan Cina di rantau Melayu sejak ratusan tahun dulu, Selepas konflik, tiada satupun yang akan menguntungkan keturunan Cina… ini fakta sejarah.
Kepada orang Cina, nasihat saya belajar apa maknanye syukur dengan nikmat yang ada…Kalau tidak bersyukur, mungkin Tuhan akan mengambil nikmat itu semula, kalaulah mereka percaya pada Tuhan.
Dalam sejarah hanya dua bangsa saja yang akan berbalah dengan bangsa yang berlainan, di negara berlainan dan pada masa yang berlainan.
Satu bangsa adalah Yahudi dan satu bangsa lagi adalah Cina. Orang Yahudi telah dikecam oleh ramai bangsa seperti Arab, German, British dll dan di halau dari satu negara ke satu negara. Mengikut sejarah telah terjadi lebih 103 pogrom dilakukan keatas bangsa Yahudi pada tiap-tiap kurun. Lebih 800 ratus tahun orang Yahudi diharamkan memasuki England dan kebanyakan negara-negara di Eropah. Sebab apa bangsa lain membenci Yahudi, Adakah sebab mereka bangsa Yahudi ke atau sebab mereka kaya? dan rajin berusaha ?..Kalau kita baca karya Shakespeare, kita akan kenal satu watak Shylock, seorang peniaga Yahudi yang begitu tamak dan berkira-kira dalam perniagaan.Sikap seperti Shylock sebati dengan jiwa Yahudi dan sikap macam nilah yang membuat bangsa lain membenci dengan orang Yahudi.
Di India, ada satu bangsa minoriti keturunan Farsi yang kaya raya tapi pernah tak dengar konflik orang India dengan bangsa Farsi. Mereka dihormati kerana mereka rajin berusaha, sikap pragmatik, tidak biadap dan juga suka menderma membangunkan hospital untuk orang miskin. Tiada konflik bangsa dan juga tiada konflik agama dengan orang Farsi ni.
Orang Cina seperti Yahudi, dimana -mana mereka menetap akan terjadi konflik pribumi dengan orang Cina. Di Malaysia, Philipines, Indonesia, Thailand, Burma, Vietnam , USA dan baru -baru ini berlaku juga di Pakiastan , negara-negara Afrika dan negara di lautan Pasifik Sebab apa berlaku konflik? Salah satu sebab karaketer orang Cina sentiasa rasa tak mencukupi dan biadap pulak.
Di Malaysia, kesemua konflik Cina dan pribumi dimulakan oleh orang Cina..Pribumi hanya bersifat reaktif ..Ini adalah fakta!
Jadi kalau mengikut pendapat saudara Sabah dan Sarawak akan jadi penentu dan kita akan dapat melihat pihak Gereja bermain politik secara terangan sekali lagi.
Bermakna bukan sahaja politik perkauman yang menanti tetapi isu isu agama juga akan menjadi pertaruhan.
Do we want to go this way…..Nescafé 3 in 1
Saya fikir penentu kuasa politik orang Melayu ialah orang Melayu sendiri.
Salah satu sikap pelik orang Melayu serta akhbar Melayu ialah secara tak sedar suka melecehkan kuasa pengundi Melayu sendiri. Contoh ketika pilihanraya kecil Bukit Gantang, akhbar Melayu kata undi Cina jadi penentu walhal Melayu lebih 70% dari jumlah pengundi.
Di Sibu dengan penduduk Cina 70% pun dikata undi Cina jadi penentu. Jadi bila masa undi Melayu jadi penentu?
Lucu kupasan ‘70%’ Shamshul :) — Helen
Inilah masalah yang yg dihadapi kebanyakan negara..rasic..perkauman yang menebal sesama kita sedangkan allah tidak ajarkan semua itu..sikap manusia yang tamak ini akan menjerumuskan kita semua kedalam kebinasaan sosial kehidupan itu sendiri..zaman kegelapan & ketakutan sedang menyelubungi kita semua..masing-masing tercari-cari arah kebenaran dan perubahan..zaman pencerahan akan tiba sebagai mana di janjikan allah tetapi sekiranya sikap&moral.. manusia itu tidak berubah, sampai bila-bila pun kita semua akan duduk dibumi ini dalam keadaan pincang serta terimalah kita azab yang pedih sebagaimana termaktub dalam setiap kitab yang allah turunkan..
Ed, Balearic Islands, Spain, did you know that that in Barcelona there is a garment company that goes by the name of Kuala Lumpur. You get them in La Ramblas. I am Barca fan bro but it was fascinating that someone from Spain had lived in KL and names his garment Kuala Lumpur in Barcelona.
Shamsul had enough lesson where I had depicted to him that MC is not one that you see with a hindsight but an objective that you can’t find in wikipedia that existed over only tha last 10 years. The battle is not about race, religion or origin, but what Malaysians per se will, and be able to do to amongst one another if this is the right thingy.
Malaysian is not something or an abject definition but what we had dwelved between us to recognize and acknowledge if something concerns another Malaysian. That is what a Malaysian should be rather in the present day than running an agenda what fits the race and religion blindly with the typical hocus pocus I know better or you know better. It is not about us but the community and their ability without infringing their own social and economic goals that enhances the community.
an addition, while those who live outside always refer itself as Malaysian, and how we eagerly want to speak malay when we meet… like my indian friends in Madrid or that fellow Oxfordian.
but the situation in malaysia is reversed. one only fight for his single race cause and doesnt mind to hurt another.
Dear MalaysianinNewYork ,
LOL… I do noticed that as well, so funny and tried to drink the water from the public pipe right in front of the shop, taste weird tho… Btw, for your information too if you were coming in Mallorca or Ibiza, we have Arroz Y Bambu (that sell lots cooking stuff from Thailand, Japan and China – One Panda sticker for each 10eur spent and), Baguz (Indonesian and Malaysian batik), Aroma (Indonesian/Bali cuisine) and if you missed chinese food, can go to Restaurante de Chino (best dumpling) or Wok (buffet style 15eur a head and eat all you want). These people went to the east, and the fall in love with their culture. Therefore the garment store in Barcelona is not a single example.
By the way, that is quite poetic IF you want to describe that the Chinese came to Malaya and fall in love and NOW really crazy to grab the power. Oh my… pardon me for that bad thinking.
If you are referring that my particular quotation i made from the wiki, perhaps it is best to know that the information also available in our course study in USM, despite only took one paper for one semester – the definition of “tin milo”, “mahathirism”, “perkara 20” etc stick quite good. Ah, I took different course when I was in USM, but was allowed to take Social Sciences study as elective, at most 8 credit hours.
I am fascinated by the idea that many people tend to think the policy by government, SOME may fail into BLACK area, not grey area. But, one thing that we as “citizen” need to know, ALL OF THE POLICIES must be in the MC framework, not a single one can go out. Therefore, if anyone ever felt that DEB/NEP and any new project does not fall in line with MC, brought it to court. I mentioned earlier, grey area, put that in mind.
Many chinese (not all, perhaps, i dont know) been asking loudly or silently for the banishment of Perkara 153 that protect the Malays interest. How do Malay react?
I would strongly agree to that, delete the whole clause… BUT, also delete Perkara 14 and Perkara 16 that gave away citizenship to the Chinese and Indian. That is the only fair way to do thing, it is a win-win situation. If you want to take something away from the Malay, remember, the Malay need to take something away from you too. Strip the Malay from the “special rights” and “strip chinese and indian citizenship”. This is harsh, but if people keep harping to these, we will go no where.
The chinese with their demand (and keep adding more) and the Malay on the side of “bertahan”, no demand or no rebut. But their withstanding will soon eroded… Perkasa is one good example, but havent started pulling all their muscle just yet.
For so many of my post, I would mentioned about OUTBURST and GRATEFUL. We only need one, but if the OUTBURST took place first, then the GRATEFUL will be too late.
Who is questioning Article 153? Criticisms of the NEP is also considered as challenging the special position (not “rights”, ok? especially since you are very sensitive to the meaning of words like “reduce”) of the Malays and the Bumiputeras? You yourself said that the MC is a living and breathing document, so why when anything about Article 153 comes up, the MC stopped breathing and you go off tangent to Article 14 and 16?
The Malays no more gave the non-Malays their citizenship, than the non-Malays gave the Malays their special position. The matter of the special position of the Malays and the Bumiputera, federal religion, national language and citizenship were among the things AGREED collectively by our founding fathers. They are not meant to be traded or bartered by one another.
I don’t think you understand Article 14-18 of the MC anyway. The acquisition of MALAYSIAN citizenship (whether Malays or non-Malays) is provided for under that section. If you delete that, it means that we all will have to revert back to the Federation of Malaya citizenship or the respective State citizenships.
And now for the really perplexing part. When you said that you want to strip away the citizenship of the non-Malays, what is it that you are proposing to do? Genocide? Just because there are Malaysians who believe in equality, you want to put all of us non-Malays on a boat and ship us out? Just because there are Malaysians who believe in being accorded equal rights and opportunities in life, you want to chase every single non-Malay in this country, right down to the very last one of us, away from the land of our birth, our home and our land? Just because there are Malaysians who had enough of the excesses and wastage perpetuated in the name of communal politics, you want to evict each and every non-Malay and their generations of offspring away from this country?
And you said “This is harsh, but if people keep harping to these, we will go no where.”
HARSH? For wanting to have a more equal and equitable Malaysia, you think it is necessary to resort to violence and genocide?
To quote Diane Mauzy, who wrote:
“Although segments of the non-Malays are among the poorest in the country, as an aggregate they are economically better off than the Malays. Furthermore, the widespread perception has been that the Chinese have dominated the economy, and through various means, have inhibited Malay participation. This perception is NOT COMPLETELY ACCURATE (and is becoming even lss accurate), but in ethnically divided states, PERCEPTIONS AND MYTHS are as important as the objective TRUTH.”
The British kept the Malays away from modern urban economy and encouraged them to pursue their traditional way of life, and the Chinese in Malaysia pays for it for generations to come. And you can go ask ANY Other Bumiputera about what they think of Article 153, and who it really benefitted.
The NEP was sold as a NEW social contract for 20 years in the aftermath of May 13th. It is now 40 over years since that watershed event. It is precisely because the Malays are so secured in their power that they can afford purges and divisional factions. That PKR can survive where S46 failed is a sign of the Malay’s confidence that it can afford to have opposing factions.
How many of you read the Laporan Majlis Perundingan Ekonomi Negara (1991) where the matter of terminating preferences were discussed? The Government suppressed the 400 over pages document and pretended it didn’t existed and selectively used bits and pieces for OPP2. Milton Esman (1991) said it best, the Chinese can expect to remain less than first-class citizens.
Me? I am just after a citizenship without first, second or third classes. We are all in this together. Some demanded unity without understanding the reassurance and freedom against formal and informal prejudice; some even demanded obeisance and keakuran, as if all non-Malays should sink in gratitude and gratefulness over the primal ‘social contract’.
Stop threatenig other Malaysians with violence, outbursts or amoks. Nobody can be grateful with threats hanging over their head or thinly veiled threats made to their face.
By Amy Chua, Yale Professor and Filipino Chinese migrant to US
Note how the ‘fair-skin’ racial groups dominate in Philippines. Amy chua discusses this at length in her section about ‘pigmentocracy’
From Aihwa Ong, UC Berkeley Prof
The Politics of Poverty Reduction , Paul Mosley From (May 23, 2012)
Also check out
Why don’t those who think malaysia is practicing class based citizenship just leave malaysia and renounce their malaysian citizenship! And, don’t blame it on Christianity either — it’s within your own community! Hint Hint..
I am sure the Aussies, brits, canadians and american all know not to trust their ethnic chinese citizens when it comes to a war with mainland China. Expect there to be more internment camps!
You forgot Thaksin. In your book, he is Chinese too, no?
There is a huge difference in state or institutional racism and the insularity of the chinks. The Chinese and Indian diaspora, like all the other migrating ethnic minorities, suffer various degrees of prosecution. Even the United States has its first half-black President almost 220 years after its founding. Malaysia has its first half-Indian Prime Minister under less than 30 years. That’s an achievement we can be proud of, although nobody would consider Mahathir as that.
Talking about internment camps, I have no doubt that lesser mortals like yourself would be thinking about them in the improbable event of China’s aggression. I mean, it doesn’t matter how many generations of non-Malays have been born in this country, most Malays continue to treat us as pendatangs who arrived on boats yesterday.
Who cares about the Aussies, Brits, Canadians or Americans? They have a higher moral standing in the matter of treatment against the minorities or the pribumis? After what has happened to the Indigenous people of America and Australia, I can’t believe an overseas bumi like yourself can claim to show how enlightened the orang puteh are.
Ed, please read perkara 14 & 16 properly. That was 1957 now it is 2012 and I believe the laws are not retrospective unless the country is intending to have a massive exodus of senior citizens from M’sia being made stateless by following your suggestion. Of course the rest of the world is going to sit down and watch this for the boat people from Malaysia. Well if say they do it in 2012 and 2012 onwards then of course it is possible to drive the current generations of the Non Malay out of the country. I hate N’Sync is correct about “acquisition of MALAYSIAN citizenship (whether Malays or non-Malays) is provided for under that section”. This would also jeorpadize the Malays in the Kampung & the rural areas unless you can show somewhere that Malays are automatic citizens in the MC.
Anyway thanks for the heads up on other places in Spain. As I have always said it it is not a battle amongst Malaysians whether non or Malay but how we continue to be blinded just for the sake of it for how it is driven by the politicians.
Malaysian in New York,
The fact on quota in civil service is there in Constitution. Perhaps you overlook it. It is printed therein the addendum.
Just because you are unable to accept reality does not mean that people are not telling the truth. If you are unable to accept it, well that is not my problem.
For your information, those who play racial card are mainly from DAP. Separate school championed by DAP literally separate Malaysians. It is the invisible wall that disunite Malaysians.
That is why people who think do not believe DAP.They know DAP is trying dismantling the rights of Malays but refuse to even compromise on anything.
DAP is fond of saying “in singapore, people are not raced bound”. But they are dumbfounded when I told them in singapore, there is no vernacular schools.
The point is very simple. Question the rights of others and your rights will be in no time questioned.
Shamsul, I haven’t overlooked it. I had explained to you before with relevant articles in the MC so to make it easier for you here is the link http://confinder.richmond.edu/admin/docs/malaysia.pdf. Please go through it and show me in which part, article and clause it says what you claim. This will put to rest the doubt of many. I don’t even want to go near the amount of the amendments to MC that had actually diluted its true purpose and spirit. Always we need to learn to differentiate between the meaning of right & position.
“The fact on quota in civil service is there in Constitution. Perhaps you overlook it. It is printed therein the addendum.”
ADDENDUM? Hahahahaha!!! This has got to be the biggest joke ever. Are you by any chance referring to the Jaduals? http://wikisource.org/wiki/Perlembagaan_Persekutuan_Malaysia/Jadual-Jadual
Show me and tell me where is this magic ratio mentioned in the Constitution (or its “addendum”). Next time you will be telling me it is written in an Errata.
OMG, this is just too funny to bear.
The point is, you are a clown Shamshul, and I am telling you, it is the SPECIAL POSITION of the Malays and the Bumiputera, not rights.
“The Malays no more gave the non-Malays their citizenship, than the non-Malays gave the Malays their special position. The matter of the special position of the Malays and the Bumiputera, federal religion, national language and citizenship were among the things AGREED collectively by our founding fathers. They are not meant to be traded or bartered by one another.”
Therefore, by your own argument, the special positions came with non-Malays citizenship. How can one negotiate one part but not the other?
Whilst the Chinese have the second class treatment, what do you think the Malays have on their forefathers land? Some Malays (which I myself had the experience) were treated poorly and my friend who worked for MNC in Penang quit his job from the pressure.
Even if Chinese Malaysian are living in their imaginary second class of whatever, their situation are very much different that any other Chinese in other nationals, except Singapore of course.
MiNY, we dont have to have genocide, just strip away the citizenship and many will be stateless and we dont have to put them on boat either. Stateless people dont have the privilege and that’s good enough, just how USA treated the Latinos and how Spain treated some of African origin.
IHateNsync, glad that I brought that news to you ;-) Dont be such a fake!
Shamshul, doesnt matter how much you try to explain and give more evidence to support your argument – some are just blinded and will twist that one time I felt like vomiting.
Btw Helen, a great post it was and I wish you the best and of course I will continue to read your posting, but leaving a comment is just like putting unnecessary effort. Some Malays are just pretending and some Chinese are just egoist. Pretending = They like the Chinese. Egoist = The still want to think of them as second class citizen.
I understand English is most likely not your first language, and that’s the same for me too. However, when I said that the Malays no more gave the non-Malays the citizenship than the non-Malays gave the Malays their special position, I am trying to point out the you that everything in the MC is agreed upon on its totality.
Over the years, YOU yourself said that parts and pieces have been amended and changed, so the problem of amendments has never been an issue. If you said that any negotiation of one part of the MC cannot be undertaken without negotiation of another – HOW ARE WE TO KNOW WHICH IS EQUIVALENT TO WHAT? I said they are not meant to be traded or bartered by one another. Either you missed that sentence or you don’t understand it.
Anecdoctal experiences related to me is not going to cut ut. For every sob-story you have about Malays in the MNC or private sector, I can give you an equivalent in the civil sector. The point being?
The slippery slope begins with stripping minorities of their citizenship rights. You do not seem to realize how disproportionate the response is to the requests for a more equitable, equal and just country.
The denial demonstrated by yourself and Shamshul is astounding. The inconsistency in thought and prejudice is damning. However, in the spirit of open communication with lesser mortals, I keep my channel open. I cannot PROVE something is not there, and the ones imagining things are you – specifically the magical ratios that appear in your constitution.
You can tell me to berambus Shamshul, it doesn’t mean I have to. This is my country too, and if you don’t like it, you can berambus too. LOL!
Refusing to integrate? We can’t all be marrying your men and women and give up our ethnic culture, practices and beliefs. Not all of us are that hard up to suck up to cognitively challenged individuals like yourselves. You can hint at the violence and purging of the non-Malays and I can’t call a spade a spade? Grow a pair of balls and say what you want to say-lah, since everytime you are exposed as a charlatan, the threats of violence comes next.
And uh, er, Ed, Egoists are people who think they are first class although they are in reality second.
Dear Ed you say ” Therefore, by your own argument, the special positions came with non-Malays citizenship. How can one negotiate one part but not the other? First and foremost, I am not arguing, just clarifying the position in Malaysia if Malaysia decides to abide by what you say. You see when we speak of an issue it has to be clear and not beating around the bush with modern day fallacy. I spoke of the issues that you raised and projected a scenario, nothing more or nothing less. Why are we bickering at each other with half past six knowledge when the issues needs to be addressed irespective of our origin but only what is fair and just for the present day Malaysia as Malaysians for the truth and reality that faces fellow Malaysians.
I hate nsyc,
Up to you to believe what you want to believe. No big deal . I do not give a damn on what you said.
I read the constitution as part of my study. It was mentioned there in the Constitution.
Whether it is special position or rights, it is the provisions for Malays. What it means is that the Malay rulers then did not grant citizenships to your parents who were immigrants then just like that. As the status of the land changes from exclusively Malay to multi racial, some recognition must be accorded to those people who are kind enough to accept “pendatang” in their midst.
It is as simple as that. So, if any snobbish people like you want to challenge the Constitution, be prepared to hear this “boleh berambus”
Malaysian in New York,
As long as Chinese refuses to integrate with Malaysians( especially Malays) then be prepared for Malays to hold very tightly to their so called special rights” . Malays see some Chinese as hypocrite for insisting the word “anak Malaysia” to be put in Surat Beranak while they ( the Chinerse) refuses to integrate with the malay.s
On the contrary Shamshul, I care a lot what you say. Everytime you say something that is untrue, that is a big possibility that many thinks like you and committing the same fallacies and mistakes about what the MC stands for.
It is strange you kept saying that the 1:4 ratio is in the Constitution. Unless your understanding of what is IN the MC and my definition of what is IN differs, I cannot see where we can meet on this? The land was never “exclusively” Malay even at time of the Federation or even before the British arrived. So why should generations of non-Malays be responsible for what the colonialists did?
And it is the special position of the Malays and the Bumiputeras, please, stop thinking of it as Malay rights. Your non-Muslim Bumiputeras have exactly the same special position, but from the way you said it, it is as if the Dayak, Penans, Orang Asli, Kadazans and Bajaus don’t count.
I hate Nsync,
Now my dear. Do not forget your manner. Please do not use “genocide” here.
Yes sir. You are right. Now I understand why in some countries sentiments against these ‘people” are so strong. They behave like “yahudi of the east”. They question others rights but they themselves refuse to integrate with other races
Why argue over interpretations let just talk facts because layman like me and millions other in the kampongs don’t go to Univs or do thesis.
Let’s just answer this melayu kampong question for me.
Is the Malay Special Position mention in the MC ?
Is it a binding contract ?
Can it be retract/changes ?
How do we go about doing it ?
No lecture please just a straight answer.
My next set of question.
Why do we have to change it ?
Why it should stay as it is ?
Now you can lecture me but not to long please…
1. The Malay and Bumiputera’s special position is enshrined in the MC. It was designed the recognize the Malays and Bumiputeras as the original people of this land and assistance must be given so that they will not be left out of national development.
2. The MC is not a contract. Any Article in the MC can be amended, some harder than the others as the MC outlined, but the rest just require a 2/3 majority. Additional requirements like the consent of the King via the Majlis Raja-raja are needed for important clauses, like citizenship etc.
3. We don’t have to change the MC or amend any Articles unnecessarily. In fact, previous amendments have wrought some negative outcomes, in particularly the balance of power between the executive, legislative and judiciary arm of this country. Change is not affected by merely rewording parts of the MC. Malaysia practices consociationalism – a form of communal politics via guaranteed group representation. In the past, it was a consultative process, nowadays, it became a rubber stamp.
4. We need to return to the spirit of the MC in executing our policies and programs, it has worked for over 50 years, despite the politikus-politikus yang membaiki labu. If you want to amend any sections in the MC, you must have a valid reason, i.e. the original situation in which the Article was formulated is no longer valid, etc.
Just something additional for the uninitiated. The Malaysian Constitution is not a living document, it is a legal document steeped in procedures. The Malaysian Constitution is also not a contract with the people, it is a document outlining the powers of the Government and its limitations. You can sue the Government for violating your Constitutional rights, but you must first prove that the Government’s action has directly injured your interests as provided for in the MC.
Many people think that the Constitution was created for them. Actually, the Constitution was created to keep those in power in check. Those who took an oath of office or service in the name of the Constitution are bound to follow its methodical prescriptions, and it is our only last recourse against an errant Government. Itu maksudnya Raja Berperlembagaan atau Negara Berperlembagaan – kuasa kerajaan kita datang daripada dokumen tersebut dan dihadkan olehnya.
Go ask any Constitutional expert worth their salt, they will tell you that the MC is definitely not a contract between or among the people. A national constitution describes a set of fundamental principles to which a state is GOVERNED.
I hate nsyc,
I beg to differ. The land called Malaysia now was previously known as Persekutuan Tanah Melayu by 1948. Before that, it was called Malay States.
So, everybody knows that MAlays can called it “exclusively” belong to malays. Kapitan Yap ah Loy and his likes at that times were “immigrants’. No offense but that was the status.
As I said earlier, cunning the British might had been .BUT until today they have been known as legalistic. Even as they tried to force Malayan Union in Malay land( which will result in Malays exactly like Palestinians) they still insist on Malay Rulers signature. Hence, the recognition.
In constitution, Malays together with Orang sungai , Orang asli were mentioned quite a number of time. Not out of love by the British . But reality does play a part here.
Actually it was quite simple. Malay Rulers would not be asked to grant citizenship to your parents or Kit Siang if they in the first place were not the sole authority on this matter.
I wrote here because people like you are fond to challenge Malay rights. Nobody is denying the rights of Chinese. If that is the intention( meaning you assume Malays questioning) , UMNO had ample time to do that. It simply can bulldoze its will on Chinese 54 years ago.
But it was not done as UMNO knows all along it is “zalim” to “menganiaya” non Malays. That is their stands despite being accuse by PAS as commiting sin for UMNO to have alliance with non Malays.
As for Bajau, orang asli, rest assured that under ruled by Malays( who are known to think about others , not like DAP) they are accounted for. Just because we know DAP only think about LIM Dynasty alone does not mean that UMNO is so eager to follow its sordid footstep.
It is also “strange” you keep challenging what accorded to Malays when in Constitution itself says “…Keutamaan dalam segi biasiswa, kouta…”
And do enlighten me where I put the blame on non Malays for what british colonial rule did in then Malay states?
Ei, sejak bila pulak the MC says “keutamaan” dalam segi biasiswa? Nak tipu pun pandailah sikit.
2.Notwithstanding anything in this Constitution, but subject to the provisions of Article 40 and of this Article, the Yang di-Pertuan Agong shall exercise his functions under this Constitution and federal law in such manner as may be NECESSARY to safeguard the special provision of the Malays and natives of any of the States of Sabah and Sarawak and to ensure the reservation for Malays and natives of any of the States of Sabah and Sarawak of such PROPORTION as he may deem REASONABLE of positions in the public service (other than the public service of a State) and of scholarships, exhibitions and other similar educational or training privileges or special facilities given or accorded by the Federal Government and, when any permit or licence for the operation of any trade or business is required by federal law, then, subject to the provisions of that law and this Article, of such permits and licences.
3.The Yang di-Pertuan Agong may, in order to ensure in accordance with Clause (2) the reservation to Malays and natives of any of the States of Sabah and Sarawak of positions in the public service and of scholarships, exhibitions and other educational or training privileges or special facilities, give such general directions as may be required for that purpose to any Commission to which Part X applies or to any authority charged with responsibility for the grant of such scholarships, exhibitions or other educational or training privileges or special facilities; and the Commission or authority shall duly comply with the directions.
(2) Walau apa pun apa-aa jua dalam Perlembagaan ini, tetapi tertakluk kepada peruntukan Perkara 40 dan peruntukan Perkara ini, Yang di-Pertuan Agong hendaklah menjalnakan fungsinya di bawah Perlembagaan ini dan undang-undang persekutuan mengikut apa-apa cara yang PERLU untuk meindungi kedudukan istimewa orang Melayu dan anak negeri mana-mana antara Negeri Sabah dan Sarawak dan untuk memastikan perizaban bagi orang Melayu dan anak negeri mana-mana antara Negeri Sabah dan Sarawak apa-apa PERKADARAN yang difikirkan MUNASABAH oleh Yang di-Pertuan Agong daripada jawatan dalam perkhidmatan awam (selain perkhidmatan awam sesuatu Negeri) dan daripada biasiswa, danasiswa dan keistimewaan pendidikan atau latihan yang seumpamanya atau kemudahan khas lain yang diberikan atau diadakan oleh Kerajaan Persekutuan dan, apabila apa-apa permit atau lesen dikehendaki oleh undang-undang persekutuan bagi mengendalikan apa-apa pertukangan atau perniagaan, maka, tertakluk kepada peruntukan undang-undang itu dan Perkara ini, daripada permit dan lesen itu.
(3) Yang di-Pertuan Agong boleh, bagi memastikan, mengikut Fasal (2), perizaban bagi orang Melayu dan anak negeri mana-mana antara Negeri Sabah dan Sarawak jawatan-jawatan dalam perkhidmatan awam dan biasiswa, danasiswa dan keistimewaan pendidikan atau latihan atau kemudahan khas lain, memberikan apa-apa arahan am yang dikehendaki bagi maksud itu kepada mana-mana Suruhanjaya yang baginya Bahagian X terpakai atau kepada mana-mana pihak berkuasa yang dipertanggungkan dengan tanggungjawab bagi pemberian biasiswa, danasiswa atau keistimewaan pendidikan atau latihan atau kemudahan khas lain itu; dan Suruhanjaya atau pihak berkuasa itu hendaklah mematuhi arahan itu dengan sewajarnya.
Perkadaran yang munasabah, bukan “keutamaan”. Shamshul ni nak pusing lagi ke?
I hate Nsyc,
Mula mula rasa marah juga baca tuduhan awak. Namun setelah mengenangkan orang jenis awak yang memang semua tahu suka putar belit, saya jadi tenang.
Tahniah Shamshul, dah zen nampaknya.
So penipuan tentang “nisbah 1:4” pengambilan penjawat awam dan “keutamaan” kuota biasiswa itu masih kira tak selesai nampaknya. Kalau kata orang, sudah terang lagi bersuluh. Kalau benda-benda yang jelas faktanya pun Shamshul boleh putar sebagai perbezaan pendapat, ternyata tak ada apa-apa lagi yang boleh dianggap mustahil.
Dear I Hate N’Sync,
What do you think about the below statement and the whole article by http://www.malaysia-today.net/mtcolumns/no-holds-barred/49824-arguing-yourself-into-a-corner ?
“We have to decide whether we want to follow the Constitution or not. We cannot scream that the Constitution must be obeyed when it suits us and then scream that we must ignore the Constitution when it does not suit us. This is what Barisan Nasional always does. Now it seems this is what the opposition also does. So how can we whack the government and accuse it of all sorts of things when we are equally guilty of that same crime?
So you see: if we propagate that we must respect the Constitution then we have to comply with the Constitution even when bad laws are ‘legally’ passed. But if we propagate that the Constitution is bad and some laws passed by Parliament that are legally allowed by the Constitution are also bad and need to be opposed then we cannot start quoting the Constitution.
We have a tendency to contradict what we say. We argue one way in one situation and then argue the other way in another situation. We need to take a stand and be consistent in that stand. For example, when we say we do not tolerate corruption we must then not tolerate it never mind who may be guilty of it. We cannot oppose it when it involves the government and tolerate it when it involves the opposition and then say that government corruption is huge while opposition corruption is small. “
Dear Man Jebat,
An argument arises when there is something disputed. The disputed items here are obvious. Shamshul and Ed claimed that the MC contained a specified ratio for civil service intake. There was none. Shamshul also claimed that priority of scholarships should be given to the Malays and that was mentioned in the MC. Again, there was no such mention.
As for RPK and the whole brouhaha about the PM being Muslim and Malay (an unnecessary distinction as any Malay in this country can only be nothing else but a Muslim), I totally agree that it is a purely academic exercise that the Constitution does not specifically bar any non-Malay, woman or non-Muslim to become the Prime Minister. That should be acknowledged outright. People believe in conventions and political realities, and the current chances a non-Malay and non-Muslim becoming the Prime Minister is very slim indeed, even if Lim Liong Sik was temporarily the pemangku during the UMNO legal crisis.
RPK is confusing the laws and the Constitution. If the Constitution itself also contains provisions for its amendment, what more the law as passed through the Parliament? Any unjust or unfair laws must still be valid, or else why should it be repealed? There is no such thing as a law “ALLOWED” by the Constitution. The Constitution is a document, it is not a living organism and it has no ability to judge what is allowed or not. That is why we have the legislative branch to pass the laws. So, similarly, anytime the Government says that the NEP is the exact expression of Article 153 of the MC, that is debatable. The interpretivistic problem is not uncommon, and that is why our judiciary is different from the US, as their role in Malaysia is not to decode the intention of the founding fathers, but merely to seek clarification from the lawmakers.
We should honor what was agreed upon by our founding fathers in the MC. That does not mean, like what Ed is saying, everything that the Government does is correct. If a good intention resulted in perversed outcomes, we cannot still endorse the erroneous approach and instead seek to improve them. That does not mean we are against Article 153 at all. Just like how the powers of the judiciary was emasculated through constitutional amendments, it is high time we give back to the courts for the necessary checks and balances.
Just to add, even if there are bad laws, it doesn’t mean everyone should start becoming anarchists. We have provisions to repeal bad laws, and until then, anyone who breaks them must expect to be punished accordingly. What do you think Gandhi’s civil disobedience was all about? Special treatment?
have to admit that i’ve never felt the need to read the MC before [shame on me, i guess :( ]. but reading this thread, esp the points given by IhNS and the RPK/MT link provided by Man Jebat, has made reading it priority #1 for me at the earliest possible opportunity.
sementara itu, saya ingin mengucapkan berbanyak2 terima kasih kpd sdr NadZree dan Man Jebat kerana mengutarakan soalan2 yang berjaya membawa perbincangan ini balik kepada tujuan bertukar2 fikiran dan sedikit sebanyak berkongsi pencerahan dan bukan semata2 untuk bertegang urat, terutama sekali drp yg kelihatan agak tercabar fakta dan pemahaman.
dan berbanyak terima kasih sdr IhNS kerana terus mengekalkan “coolness” dan tidak berganjak drp terus berbincang secara tidak terlalu emosi, malah bertaakul dan berlandaskan fakta. *saya tabik!*
I hate Nsync,
Kalau tak percaya nak buat macam mana. Teruslah pertikaikan. Tak jadi masalah pada saya.
Nak cakap penipu ke pun tak apa. Ini bukan saya cakap. Saya belajar dan ada material nya dulu semasa saya belajar. Bukan saya cakap ratio 1:4. Memang dinyatakan disitu.
Nak menolak kebenaran dengan menuduh orang lain menipu itu awak punya pasal.
Shamshul, nobody is saying the ratio for intake of SUPPORT level staff was not used. It WAS, it was executed so diligently and so well that the civil service is now over 80%-90% Malay and Bumiputera, and it spilled over into PROFESSIONAL & MANAGERIAL levels, so much so it was now irrelevant and unnecessary. We are just trying very hard, to tell you, that the ration 1:4 was never in the Malaysian Constitution, but an approach taken, like the NEP policy to actualize the intent of Article 153.
Big difference, no?
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