Posted in Umno

Satu soalan, boleh pembaca budiman tolong beri pencerahan?

Bersambung dari ‘Sentimen anti-Cina kian membara

Apa yang difahamkan anda sebagai konsep ‘Ketuanan Melayu’ [yang kononnya sedang dicabar itu]?

Gambar ehsan Dr Novandri Hasan Basri

Demo Umno di Bukit Mertajam pagi tadi.

(35 patah perkataan)

Author:

I have no Faceook or Twitter.

120 thoughts on “Satu soalan, boleh pembaca budiman tolong beri pencerahan?

    1. Conflated with Islam, like Article 160 definition of ‘Malay’?

      So with this kalimah ‘Allah’ issue, do Malays feel that Islam is challenged or that Ketuanan Melayu is challenged?

      Another pix from the demo:

      null

      1. Traditionally the Malay kingdom and Islam are synonymously binded to form the very core of the Malays culture on its own. Due to that the Malays are equally felt being threaten whenever the ketuanan Melayu are being questioned or kalimah Allah being abused by the Catholic church priest with the help of their opposition political subbodinates that have been giving them divided support to abused the kalimah into SYIRIK.

        1. salam,if u ra atrue christIant please refer to (KANNEH BOSOM)noting to do with ketuanan melayu on kalimah ALLAH into SYIRIK ASK HUSSAIN BARAK OBAMA PRESIDENT USA WANT KALIMAH ALLAH ISLAM AND Catholic church priest UNDER ONE WORLDS RELIGION (CHRISLAM)
          Tq BABA KHAN

  1. I think the term was coined/brought up by BABI (yes pun intended) @ Ketua UMUM PKR in his early year as Ketua Pembangkang to rally the non-Malay support, as it is after PRU10 and PRU11 the majority of non-Malays are solid behind BN.

    This is to replace “Hak Keistemewaan Bumiputeraan” which sounds mild and non threatening, while “Ketuanan Melayu” is akin to White Supremacy.

      1. Right after he came back from the US and after taking over from Wan Azizah in Permatang Pauh, circa 2006 to 2007.

        1. You could be right that the term was not in the political vocabulary of the Umno presidents, from Tunku to Dr M. Indeed, an interesting point to discover.

          Discussions like this are good. We unearth stuff that we’ve just taken for granted without deeper questioning.

      2. “Although the idea itself predates Malaysian independence, the phrase ketuanan Melayu did not come into vogue until the early 2000s decade. Historically, the most vocal political opposition towards the concept has come from non-Malay-based parties, such as the Malaysian People’s Movement Party (Gerakan) and Democratic Action Party (DAP); in the 2000s decade, the multiracial Parti Keadilan Rakyat also positioned itself against ketuanan Melayu, advocating instead ketuanan rakyat (supremacy of the people). The idea of Malay supremacy gained attention in the 1940s, when the Malays organized themselves to protest the Malayan Union’s establishment, and later fought for independence. During the 1960s, there was a substantial effort challenging ketuanan Melayu led by the People’s Action Party (PAP) of Singapore — which was a state in Malaysia from 1963 to 1965 — and the DAP after Singapore’s secession. However, the portions of the Constitution related to ketuanan Melayu were “entrenched” after the racial riots of 13 May 1969, which followed an election campaign focused on the issue of non-Malay rights and ketuanan Melayu. This period also saw the rise of “ultras” who advocated a one-party government led by UMNO, and an increased emphasis on the Malays being the “definitive people” of Malaysia — i.e. only a Malay could be a true Malaysian.”

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketuanan_Melayu

        1. Good lead, LOL.

          We should read the speeches made by the politicians during the election campaign of April-May 1969.

        2. Expect the Redbeanie and Cyber trouper to change the above soon. But as it is now, more or less that para is correct to my understanding and observation.

  2. Helen,

    Negara ini dibina atas persetujuan sultan-sultan negeri2 melayu. Asas pemerintahan negeri-negeri melayu ini berteras kepada agama Islam. Asas ini telah diterapkan kedalam perlembagaan negara dan dijadikan teras pemerintahan negara ini.

    Sekiranya sesiapa yang cuba mempertikai, memperlekeh dan menghina sistem yang telah sedia ujud ini maka ia secara tidak langsung boleh dianggap mempertikaikan pemerintahan kerajaan melayu. Kita harus ingat walaupun negara ini amal demolkrasi tetapi kuasa pemerintahan tidak boleh keluar dari asas2 ini.

    Mungkin ada yang lain boleh ulas secara terperinci lagi.

    1. Sistem pemerintahan kita adalah Demokrasi Raja Berperlembagaan.

      Ketuanan Melayu bukan seerti dengan Raja-raja Melayu.

      Merujuk kepada kain rentang itu, “Jangan cabar ketuanan Melayu”, saya rasa Raja-raja setakat ini tidak dicabar oleh DAP.

      Yang ada itu, evangelista cabar mimbar.

      1. Re. saya rasa Raja-raja setakat ini tidak dicabar oleh DAP.

        Hina Sultan Perak – Karpal Singh Diarah Bela Diri

        PUTRAJAYA, 20 JAN : Mahkamah Rayuan memerintahkan Karpal Singh membela diri atas dakwaan mengeluarkan kenyataan menghasut terhadap Sultan Perak, dua tahun lalu.

        Pembebasan beliau daripada tuduhan itu oleh Mahkamah Tinggi Ipoh dibatalkan dan perbicaraan baru kes itu akan bermula pada 9 Febuari.

        Karpal berkata beliau akan mengemukakan permohonan di Mahkamah Persekutuan, merayu keputusan itu.

        http://www.antarapos.com/v1/index.php?q9nan56SpKPkoObnaNGXpVvZn7Wla5ln

        Dan ada beberapa lagi kes yang hanya tengelam begitu saja, kerana Sultan Sultan tidak berminat memanjangkan isu.

          1. Saksi: Karpal sebut tindakan terhadap Sultan Perak

            “Peguam Karpal Singh dalam sidang akhbarnya ada menyebut bahawa tindakan mahkamah akan diambil terhadap Sultan Perak dan kerajaan baru, sekiranya majlis mengangkat sumpah Datuk Seri Dr Zamry Abdul Kadir sebagai menteri besar Perak diteruskan, Mahkamah Tinggi diberitahu hari ini.”

            http://beta.malaysiakini.com/news/119634

            1. LOL,

              Jangan kita samakan sebarang percakapan ataupun tindakan yang berciri ‘biadap’ sebagai mencabar kewibawaan Sultan atau Agung. Kena tengok inti-pati isu tersebut. Pertama, tindakan mahkamah sememangnya boleh diambil terhadap Sultan. Rujuk kes ini:

              http://www.thestar.com.my/story.aspx/?file=%2f2008%2f10%2f15%2fnation%2f20081015111007&sec=nation

              Jika anda mempunyai ‘strong case’ terhadap mana-mana Sultan, anda boleh mendakwa Sultan di Mahkamah Khas. Sultan dan Agung sudah hilang kekebalan pada zaman Mahathir setelah perlembagaan dipinda pada 1993.

              Per: “Peguam Karpal Singh dalam sidang akhbarnya ada menyebut bahawa tindakan mahkamah akan diambil terhadap Sultan Perak dan kerajaan baru, sekiranya majlis mengangkat sumpah Datuk Seri Dr Zamry Abdul Kadir sebagai menteri besar Perak diteruskan, Mahkamah Tinggi diberitahu hari ini.”

              Jika betul Karpal Singh mengambil tindakan mahkamah terhadap Sultan Perak, hakim yang akan menentukan sama ada Sultan Perak telah bertindak di luar bidang kuasa undang-undang.

              Jika Karpal Singh boleh dianggap menghasut kerana menyatakan ‘tindakan mahkamah boleh diambil terhadap Sultan Perak’, bagaimana pula dengan tindakan Mahathir tahun 1993 yang melupuskan kekebalan Sultan?

              1. Re. Karpal Singh

                When news got into paper and portals more or less, it has been either white wash or spin depending on which side is reporting it. But I remember speficically how KURANG AJAR this OKU wheelchair is with his statement during that point of time.

                Re. Jika Karpal Singh boleh dianggap menghasut kerana menyatakan ‘tindakan mahkamah boleh diambil terhadap Sultan Perak’, bagaimana pula dengan tindakan Mahathir tahun 1993 yang melupuskan kekebalan Sultan?

                I don’t like to discuss this, but I totally agree with Tun M. During that period there are numerous cases and incidents that led to the decision. I remember a few important details about that.

                1. re: But I remember speficically how KURANG AJAR this OKU wheelchair is with his statement during that point of time.

                  It may appear kurang ajar to you but not for me. The test here is not an individual perception, but a legal test as Karpal is charged under sedition for uttering certain statements.

                  re: I don’t like to discuss this, but I totally agree with Tun M. During that period there are numerous cases and incidents that led to the decision. I remember a few important details about that.

                  It was the decision of Mahathir back in 1993 in removing the royal immunity that allow royalties to be brought to court. I don’t see anything seditious for a person to say that the Sultan of Perak may be sued in court because this is exactly the legal position today.

                  Just like the example of Stanchart suing Negeri Sembilan YDPB. Stanchart was successful as it has a good case against the YDPB. Let us assume Stanchart failed due to lack of evidence/witness. Do you think Stanchart has committed sedition for bringing an unsubstantiated court case against the YDPB?

      2. Helen, what you think, is of no matter, to these people. You, the sole chinese apologist blog on the pro BN blog roll, cannot counter the damage to the good will between race by the DAP’s RBA.

        Even your intention (at least to me) remain questionable, when considering your postings during your pre blogging days.

        It seem to me that you play the part of a ‘sounding rod’ for your employer, to draw comment and gauge the malay sentiment/anger.

        Like i say, it’s too late for CPR, the patient is brain dead. The days of the Zombies is upon us.

        1. re: “Helen, what you think, is of no matter, to these people.”

          Those people have created the gejala sembahyang dua imam among the Chinese community. Most unfortunately the ratio is 1:9. Whatever I think or say, or anybody who’s non-DAP thinks or says, is impossible to penetrate their Great Wall.

          re: “You, the sole chinese apologist blog on the pro BN blog roll, cannot counter the damage to the goodwill between race by the DAP’s RBA.”

          I cannot even counter the damage that they are doing to my reputation through their vicious smear campaign in cyberspace and social media.

          re: “Even your intention (at least to me) remain questionable, when considering your postings during your pre blogging days.”

          In my pre-blogging days, the DAP did not have their munafik sitting as Puan Speaker; did not have 95 DUN seats and did not have the party turning into Lim Guan Eng & Tentacles (i.e. their recent ouster of the Johor party chairman).

          Now the evangelistas control the English media (in my pre-blogging days, they did not have Selangor Times) and the Dapsters, like Mao Zedong’s Red Guards, are terrorizing the countryside. The political circumstances have changed, even my vote has changed. Given all of this, how can my writing remain the same?

          re: “It seem to me that you play the part of a ‘sounding rod’ for your employer, to draw comment and gauge the malay sentiment/anger.”

          I’m in the 10 percent. Meaning 9 out of 10 Chinese will refuse to credit what I write. They’re living in their Dapster bubble getting drunk on the evangelista Holy Water.

          You’re partly right in that I blog “to draw comment and gauge the Malay sentiment/anger” … because I’m a researcher lah. Rather than the Dapsters who simply make assumptions and throw wild accusations, I run my little opinion polls :D to gather empirical data.

          And some of your comments do help in my work, for example LOL’s reminder that it was Anwar who pushed the “Ketuanan Melayu” label as well as the idea to look into 1969 campaign speeches.

          I do and have made an accurate reading both of Malay sentiment and the political ground. For example, the Umcedel findings that 77 percent of Malays object to non-Muslims using the ‘Allah’ word doesn’t surprise me one bit. However the majority of the Chinese prefer to fault Umcedel as either “Umno lapdogs” or having carried out a flawed survey (roll my eyes: when the results are agreeable to them, they will ‘Like’ and Facebook, when the results don;t favour their worldview, they rubbish the pollster).

          re: “Like i say, it’s too late for CPR, the patient is brain dead. The days of the Zombies is upon us.”

          I do not think the Chinese oppo is capable of pulling the handbrake. Umno is also losing its grip. It looks very much like DAP Chinese vs Umno Malays.

          1. “I cannot even counter the damage that they are doing to my reputation through their vicious smear campaign in cyberspace and social media.”

            True,

            But on the other hand, again with reference to the Newton’s 3rd Law, you became famous and earned the respect, of those who see DAP for what they are.

            In the end, because the #vernacubengs are still the minority, you won more people.

            1. re: “In the end, because the #vernacubengs are still the minority, you won more people.”

              YEESSSSS!!

      3. Ref: Sistem kita adalah Demokrasi Raja Berpelembagaan.

        Walaupun sistem kita Demokrasi Raja Berpelemnbagaan, Raja2 Melayu masih mempunyai kuasa atas Agama Islam.

        Raja2 Melayu melalui Yang Di Pertuan Agong juga mempumyai kuasa melantik Perdana Menteri di mana PM dan kabinet mengangkat sumpah memegang jawatan di hadapan Baginda.

        Kita juga harus faham Raja2 Melayu adalah lambang kuasa melayu.

        Ref; saya rasa Raja-raja setakat ini tidak dicabar

        Tindakan2 dan cakap2 menunjukkan ia sedang menuju ke arah itu. Sekarang ini belum lagi berkuasa. Kena lihat lah bila sudah ada kuasa dan disokong pula oleh melayu moderate dan liberal.

        1. re: “Kita juga harus faham Raja2 Melayu adalah lambang kuasa melayu.”

          Maybe b’cos Penang does not have Raja Melayu, that’s why the Machang Bubuk kangkung insult happened there.

          1. Helen,

            Let me give an idea from Malay perspective. Of course, you will not find this in STAR.

            Several years ago, an insolent guy (a Chinese) showed his middle finger to a lady. And the lady is none other than the consort of Yang DiPertuan Agong.

            Showing a middle finger to a woman is already an insult. What more to your own queen.

            The interesting part is that he proudly told that “ini negeri Cina”. No doubt he was punished as law dictates. But it shows character.

            With no intention top insult, I must say that many chinese especially the politicians from DAP and PKR are plain “biadap”. They test the Malay patience to the limit.

            Tian Chua accused UMNO (meaning Malays) engineered Lahad Datu incident. And i find it amusing that stories of numerous Malay stalls demolished in Penang simply never find their ways into STAR.

            When I told off my Chinese friends, again they started with disbelief. I can vouch on the genuineness of the stories as my family resides in Penang.

            Chinese politicians turn the picture by accusing UMNO is the one drumming the racial card. What happen Malay ground is simply the reaction towards racist policies of DAP and to a lesser extent PKR.

            AS FOR KANGKUNG ISSUE, the more Najib is vilified, the more Malays rally towards UMNO. Not out of love but it is proven again and again at least UMNO is not “faces” like PAS.

            What happen to GIATMARA again will bring Malays closer to UMNO. As no one in Selangor govt can give reasonable explanation as why on earth MB is so hard on this training centres but so lenient on massage parlours, than the govt of the day in Selangor must realise that this is how Malay perceive the issue.

            No doubt UMNO bring out the issue. If not UMNO, who will? DAP?

            Woe betide the malays should UMNO is ‘gone with the wind’.

              1. Apa lagi Cina mau?

                Makan kangkung sama bak kut teh… semestinya tanpa GST tapi mahu banyak msg (supaya cepat mati) ..lol

      4. Fazillah’s comment on ketuanan Melayu triggered something in my memory or my understanding from way back. Ketuanan melayu is always synonymous with the fact that the raja2 has a special position, they r the lords of the land, n their positions the not to be questioned. As the raja2 are Melayu, therefore, only by this extension that the Malays has that position.

        In addition, in the past, the terms have never been used in as many occasion to rally points like now.

        However, my memory might have failed me n I might be wrong.

        I never 100% trust the definition or articles presented in Wikipedia. Anybody can make an entry and any tom dick n Harry can amend the entry.

        1. Re. Baru Jadi melayu.

          Care to explain further. This is very interesting in fact for changing one religious belief is pretty common but ethnicity, this is the first time I heard.

  3. Bila dicabar, kau lari….bitch la tuu
    Put my full comments will you? Takut? You pon dapster la. Muyhiddin’s anjing..,..

    1. Apa yang awak merepek ni? Lupa makan ubat sakit kepala ke? Cakap macam orang tak berpelajaran dan tiada adab. Tak payah la buang masa nak komen kat sini. Buat malu je.

      1. Dah mAkAn ubat la. I Tanya tapi dapat jawapan ……I pon dah belajar dan beradab. Nawab soalan i. Kena pea nak gasak PM. Sepatutnya tolong tapi nak hantam. Jaga la sikit PM terhormat kita.

        1. Re. Kena pea nak gasak PM.

          Dari segi apa tu? Saya rasa rata-ratanya pengikut blog ini sememangnya ada kecenderungan “Gasak PM”, kecuali saya. Tapi itu hak mereka, kalau awak tak setuju, TIRU MACAM SAYA i.e. pertahankanlah dia.

          You are so full of it, do you know that….

          1. LOL,

            re: “You are so full of it, do you know that….”

            Some people wonder why I don’t support the opposition.

            When chameleon-‘Melayu’s macam seekor ni are the backbone of the oppo, it just makes their side feel so slimy. I reckon you’re getting the same vibes that I am since he slithered here.

            1. Helen,

              The tragedy is that Anwar thinks he is using DAP to achieve his political am bition.

              The truth is that DAP is using Anwar And PAS to bring down Malay political power. And only a moron will think that Anwar should be the PM should UMNO collapses.

              As soon as UMNO collapses, more proof of Anwar indiscretion wiill be circulated. And it all will lead to one conclusion. THAT ANWAR DOES NOT FIT TO BE PM.

          1. Dia RBA. In my 2-and-1/2 years moderating this blog, I’ve never come across a Melayu using his vocabulary.

  4. Ketuanan is prior tha 1511. That too is ketuanan Hindu. Pls refer to the Hindu kings and it’s works from 1510-0800. Just look at lembah Bujang and the Johor Hindu kingdom (being covered by BN). So, if melayu dah layu, don’t blame other race, including yr cina race

    1. Re. Ketuanan is prior tha 1511. That too is ketuanan Hindu. Pls refer to the Hindu kings and it’s works from 1510-0800

      Hindu is a religion not an ethnicity. You are self contradicting, where in above post you stated :

      “Ketuaan Melayu is umno deal. No where in ISLAM is ketuanan.
      Capish! ”

      Meaning to say, it was ok for the Hindu to be Tuan but it is not ok for Islam and by default Melayu to be Tuan? BTW, please read who actually coined the term Ketuan Melayu which I have posted above.

    2. As LOL said Hindu is religion.

      You know as far as I can remember the Malays have never denied that when Islam came to Melaka, the Sultan embraced it and in turn the Malays, being loyal subjects of the Sultan, converted to Islam and from then on, the Malays of the Peninsular were known to be Muslims. Prior to that, the Malays were Hindus, into animism and who knows what else, but never Christians I think. We acknowledge that as our “zaman jahiliyah”.

      Ketuanan Melayu is not an Umno deal. Ketuanan Melayu is the proud offspring of your very own Anwar Ibrahim. (Go research the glory days of Anwar Ibrahim when he was the “wonder boy” and the major corruptor of the Malaysian finances).

      (Off topic: Anwar denied entry into Japan – made my day!!!)

  5. Lol, what a joke! My ketuanan if you are learned person would know I mean umno. I am merely portraying how the melayus are (some of them) were hindus. My point is, Islam is being prostituted by umno. The point is Helen ang (if that is her\her name) is trying to burn this country by her hatred.

    Hope reasonable people see the scam and hatred of this blog

      1. ROTFL… panas bontot ke?

        Re. Terus wa jadi keling

        What’s wrong of being KELING? One of my aunts by marriage is KELING.

    1. Re. My ketuanan if you are learned person would know I mean umno.

      United Malay National Organization and yes it represents the Malay of various decent.

      Re. My point is, Islam is being prostituted by umno.

      Just like what PAS did you mean? Bersekongkol dengan DAP yang terang-terangan anti ISLAM.

      Re. The point is Helen ang (if that is her\her name) is trying to burn this country by her hatred.

      Please take a stroll at TMI, MI and various pro-oppo blogs and you will understand what hatred means.

  6. It is very clear this “admin” preaching greatness would not approve “certain” comments. Just like a true blue dapster….what a joke

    1. Hullo, you just put your comments 20 minutes ago. Are you expecting that I must instantly attend to you, at your immediate service?

      And if you’re a Melayu, then I’m the Queen of Sheba. What kind of people are you? The way you operate is repulsive and revolting.

      1. haiya akak. why should you layan these low life creature. this type of people are funny. they always manipulate the term rakyat whereas their attitude is akin or more towards tuan. see how pushy he/she can be when not getting something. tantrum mengalahkan baby baru lahir.

    1. Could you please at least learn to write and spell properly? It’s hard to take you seriously if you seem so ill-educated. Sure, uneducated farmers can also be wise, but unfortunately that doesn’t apply to you, either: komen pun entah apa-apa meraban, sifar ilmu.

  7. Anak kecil main api
    Terbakar hatinya yang sepi
    Air mata darah bercampur keringat
    Bumi dipijak milik orang

    Nenek moyang kaya raya
    Tergadai seluruh harta benda
    Akibat sengketa sesamalah kita
    Cinta lenyap di arus zaman

    Indahnya bumi kita ini
    Warisan berkurun lamanya
    Hasil mengalir ke tangan yang lain
    Peribumi merintih sendiri

    Masa depan sungguh kelam
    Kan lenyap peristiwa semalam
    Tertutuplah hati terkunci mati
    Maruah peribadi dah hilang

    Kini kita cuma tinggal kuasa
    Yang akan menentukan bangsa
    Bersatulah hati bersama berbakti
    Pulih kembali harga diri

    Kita sudah tiada masa
    Majulah dengan maha perkasa
    Janganlah terlalai teruskan usaha
    Melayu kan gagah di nusantara (3X)

    **********
    I think this was frequent in BTN courses. Don’t know what happen to BTN now. Just my personal opinion, I think this Ketuanan Melayu serves as a reminder and to raise the spirits of us Malays who should do better because we are after all living in Malay homeland, we are the indigenous and majority inhabitants of our homeland, and that political power helps to keeps us safe only so far and that can change. There will always be challengers like the Malayan Union, the communists and maybe others seeking to undermine us more and more.

    You should ask this to non Malays too. Seems to me like they think of it as another UMNO created racist propaganda, comparing it to white supremacy and Nazi racial superiority.

    1. re: “political power helps to keeps us safe only so far and that can change”

      Lately, looking at how aggressive the DAP is and how licik the evangelistas are, I’m beginning to think that you guys (Malays) will hold on to 153 as your protective amulet… to keep you safe.

      Even your Allah pun diorang nak kebas.

      1. DAP can afford to keep on the aggressive without fear of massive backlash because they think they have the consent and support of PKR and PAS supporters.

        With the silence of PAS on religious issues they can spin any objection to their posturing on religious matters as UMNO propaganda.

        Sadly to say, with the state of UMNO nowadays, it’s becoming easier for anyone to blame them.

        BTW I wonder if anyone will comment on you saying ‘protective amulet’, that’s considered a great sin in Islam, even if some Muslims depend and use things like it. Anyway the constitution can be amended too.

        1. re: “DAP can afford to keep on the aggressive without fear of massive backlash because they think they have the consent and support of PKR and PAS supporters.”

          Could be. There’s Mujahid and Khalid Gereja and Hanipa, and not forgetting Guang Eng’s Big Brother Mat Sabu

          re: “With the silence of PAS on religious issues they can spin any objection to their posturing on religious matters as UMNO propaganda. Sadly to say, with the state of UMNO nowadays, it’s becoming easier for anyone to blame them.”

          Yup, Umno is in a miserable state. The PM made headlines with “I like to eat kangkung”. Tepuk dahi.

          re: “BTW I wonder if anyone will comment on you saying ‘protective amulet’, that’s considered a great sin in Islam, even if some Muslims depend and use things like it.”

          The cultural gulf between us.

          re: “Anyway the constitution can be amended too.”

          153 requires the approval of the Council of Rulers. So I don’t think that it can be touched.

          1. Postscript

            However 153 can be subverted by the Hannah Yeoh strategy of making Anak Malaysia babies – “there are no Chinese, no Indians, no Malays in DAP, only Malaysians”, and making Malays feel guilty as racists for being their race.

            1. ‘protective amulet’

              Melayu dah biasa dengan tangkai/thangka

              ‘Devotional images act as the centerpiece during a ritual or ceremony and are often used as mediums through which one can offer prayers or make requests’

              http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thangka

              ‘great sin in Islam’

              Thus the dis-ownership of the tangkai as being Tibetan first and foremost.

              Didn’t we taught I-Tsing and Atisa the Tantra?

              ‘So that when
              Yi-tsing visited Sn-vijaya (671-672 A.D.) he was
              amazed at the learning of the Buddhist priests of the
              place. In fact within a few years, Sumatra became
              the most famous centre of Buddhist learning and no
              Buddhist priest could be said to have completed his
              education unless he had studied at this important
              centre of Buddhist theology. The famous Indian
              monk, Atisa otherwise called Dipankara-Srijnana of
              the Vikramsila monastery of Bihar spent ten years in
              Sumatra in order to complete his studies in the pure
              doctrine of the Sarvastivadins under Acarya Candra-
              kirti, the High Priest of Suvarnadvipa.’

              http://www.sabrizain.org/malaya/library/suvarnadwipa.txt

              1. Never heard of this before.
                Aren’t they called tangkal instead of thangkai/thangka?
                As in menangkal(defending, repelling).
                Also pretty unlikely to see tangkal or azimat being in the form of some elaborate buddhist pictures.

                1. ‘Aren’t they called tangkal instead of thangkai/thangka?’

                  I’m from the north and we called it tangkai.

                  ‘Also pretty unlikely to see tangkal or azimat being in the form of some elaborate buddhist pictures.’

                  Of course and why are you sound so surprised? The mantra expectedly had been changed into some Quranic verses (this is syirik too, in my opinion). You might want to check some Campa’s Science and Technologies manuskrips at L’Ecole Francaise D’Extreme Orient on azimats.

                  ‘(1) Azimat: (*) CAM 51(2)(4), CAM 53(2), CAM 59(12), CAM 88(3), CAM 129(2), CAM 147(14); (**) CM 39(8).’

                  page 13

                  Click to access %281%29Vol6_MohammadAlinor.pdf

                  ‘…dan sebuah manuskrip bertarikh kurun ke-11M di Tibet bertajuk Abhisamayalamkara-nama-prajnaparamitopadesasastravrrtti-durbodhaloka-nama-tika, yang merupakan ulasan oleh Dharmakirti Suvarnabhumi pada tahun 1005M. Beliau adalah seorang pendeta Melayu beragama Buddha di Suvarnabhumi/Sriwijaya. Ulasan ini diterjemahkan ke bahasa Tibet sebelum tahun 1069M oleh muridnya Atisa berjudul Shes rsb kyi phs rol tu phyin pa’i man ngag gi bstan bcos mngon par rtogs pa’i rgyan ces bya ba’i ‘grel pa stogs par dka’ ba’i snag ba zhes bya ba’i grel bshad. Buku ini diedit oleh Cordier pada 1915 di Paris, terbitan Imprimerie Nationale, dan juga diedit oleh Suzuki pada 1957 di Tokyo-Kyoto, terbitan Tibetan Tripitaka Research Institute.’

                  page 7

                  Click to access %281%29Vol6_MohammadAlinor.pdf

                  ‘Perpustakaan Tun Sri Lanang, UKM, memiliki 2 naskhah
                  Nan-Hai-Ji-Gui-Nei-Fa-Zhuan yang telah diterjemahkan ke bahasa Inggeris oleh Takakushu. Buku ini adalah berkenaan hal-hal peribadatan penganut Buddha di India dan Sriwijaya. Satu maklumat penting dalam buku berkenaan adalah
                  berkenaan guru I-Tsing di Sriwijaya yang bernama Sakyakirti. Tiga orang guru beliau yang lain adalah dari India. Tiada maklumat lanjut setakat ini yang didapat tentang Sakyakirti, tentunya juga seorang pendeta Melayu beragama Buddha.’

                  page 15

                  Click to access %281%29Vol6_MohammadAlinor.pdf

                  Gautama Buddha Sakyamuni?

                  Do read more on the Kambojas and the Sakas/Scythians

                  1. Well in Malay and Indonesian dictionaries tangkal is the word for amulets and talismans.

                    So, northern word due to local dialect way of pronouncing words or taking the word from Thai?

                    1. Suku Thai pun belum turun lagi la brader!

                      ‘The early inhabitants of Langkasuka were probably an eclectic assemblage of early Malays, Mons and Khmers. The maritime nature of the polity alludes to Austronesian (the greater Malay group) dominance. Significant Sumatran Malay acculturation commenced with the Sri Vijayan conquest of the Kra Isthmus in the 8th century. The Langkasukans were certainly not T’ais. At that time, the ancestral T’ais were still in the hills and river valleys of Yunnan prior to being displaced to Indo-China by the Han Chinese.’

                      http://id-id.facebook.com/notes/%D9%81%D8%A7%D9%8A%D8%B2-%D9%86%D8%A7%D9%82%D9%85%D8%A7%D9%86/mon-myanmar-and-khmer-cambodia-are-our-distant-malay-relatives/73920458428?ref=nf

                2. Tangkal, Azimat and the likes are considered “Khurafat” and “Syirik” in Islam but many Muslims still practice or keep it unfortunately.

              1. Maybe. Still doesn’t change the fact that somebody got the Sultans to sign away stuff, their powers even.

                Chaotic times also have chance of occurring again.

                1. The Sultans had a different kind of relationship with MacMichael and the English residents than they do with Pakatan.

                  There is a high level of distrust for DAP. That’s why Ngeh failed to become MB of Perak even though the Sultan had the discretion to waive the requirement for the MB to be Malay-Muslim.

                  Also, I think the DAP would have been more powerful in Selangor if the Sultan is less assertive.

  8. Dear Aunty Helen,

    From the DBP’s Pusat Rujukan Persuratan Melayu website, the meaning of ketuanan is: hak menguasai dan memerintah sebuah (negeri, daerah, dll), kedaulatan.

    To put it simply, I think ketuanan Melayu means the place of the Malays as the tuan tanah of the Tanah Melayu. As we know, Malaysia is a federation of different Malay states under their respective sultans meaning those states used to be a country of its own. So when Malaysia gained independence, the Malays gave the citizenships to the immigrants in return for their promise to agree with the social contract where the Malays were given special privileges as the tuan tanah. This was also written in the Article 153 of the Federal Constitution.

    Just like guests staying at a friend’s house should respect his friend’s right as the owner of his own house, we the commenters should respect Aunty Helen’s as the tuan tanah of this blog and accommodate our comments to your house rules. :D

  9. I don’t suppose punching a non-Malay deputy minister counts? hehehe.

    Although I’m not in the target group of the ketuanan concept, it is obvious that it means power and control. The thing is, whatever laws, ideologies, or rights etc. enshrined or otherwise, means little. It is the actions and how it’s used that is important and would determine how the people perceive it.

    To the non-Malays, it carries a negative connotation, which simply means lording over and discrimination.

    To the Malays, the meaning varies as well. But I suppose most would tend to take it to mean ownership. That also means the others are excluded from any stake.

    On the flip-side, the original concept of special position, is one that positions the beneficiaries as weak and in need of protection. Until today, the Malays still view themselves as such, hence the defensive mentality.

    Ketuanan, otoh, lifts their self-esteem and pride. It works wonders when applied in politics & government. But at the individual level, the concept losses it’s context. What would a person do with ketuanan? Hence, we have Ketuanan = 153 = Balik China. :)

    1. re: “That also means the others are excluded from any stake.”

      Looks like it. That’s the appeal of the DAP, to enable the minorities to stake a share.

      1. I believe that DAP managed to take that to a another level, which is destructive. To exploit and radicalise the people to be anti-establishment is irresponsible. What is happening now is that they are the ones dictating both the problems and the solutions.

  10. “tuan” tidak bermakna superior. dalam rumah kita, kitalah tuan rumah, tapi tak bermakna kita lebih super dari tetamu kita. terjemahan inggeris “super” kpd “tuan” tidak sesuai tapi banyak non-malay yg menggunakan perkataan “supremacy”. pembetulan harus dibuat. itulah, akibat salah terjemah, timbul salah pemahaman. suruh belajar bm tak nak.

    1. GURINDAM Pasal 7 (nasihat orang bangsawan Raja Ali Haji):

      Jika hendak mengenai orang berbangsa,
      lihat kepada budi dan bahasa,
      Jika hendak mengenal orang yang berbahagia,
      sangat memeliharakan diri dari yang sia-sia.
      Jika hendak mengenal orang mulia,
      lihatlah kepada kelakuan dia.
      Jika hendak mengenal orang yang berilmu,
      bertanya dan belajar tiadalah jemu.
      Jika hendak mengenal orang yang berakal,
      maka di dalam dunia mengambil bekal.
      Jika hendak mengenal orang yang baik perangai,
      lihat pada ketika bercampur dengan orang ramai.

  11. Haprak to all those who do not understand or refuse the true meaning of “Ketuanan Melayu”, no matter who they are, Chinese, Malay, Indians or others. What if Lim Eng Guan shouts in return, “Ketuanan Cina”….. Will you feel offended or angry?

    I opined that Ketuanan Melayu reflects the truth of all Malays that since all of us have agreed to give the political power to the Malays as prescribed in the Federal Constitution, why should we question the government’s policy, even if they are not deemed to be fair to you as of now? On the contrary, we have also acknowledged that the Chinese, who are the majority within the minority should be given the bigger cake in the economic and financial sectors because the are good in what they are doing! The cake is now being enlarged and to be shared as fair as possible and it’s only possible if all the transformation policies will be put in place, with some sacrifices by all patriotic Malaysians.

    This country will fail miserably if we fail to accommodate everyone and everything fairly in our implementation of all development program’s. It’s not about the magic word “Ketuanan Melayu” as being advocated and the term abused openly like the extremism in Perkasa’s ideologies. Do you seriously think that the BN government under Najib’s leadership and administration will listen to all the sundries churned out by Ibrahim Ali and his cronies? I believe not all ideas and advice by former PM Tun Mahathir will have to be taken seriously by Najib, but the respect should be accorded to Tun Mahathir in his wisdom, experience and visionary views in further developing this nation and country.

  12. WE ALL KNOW WHo INCITED MAY 13.
    This idiotic chauvinistic Chinese is at it again !
    May be he is born not to be a peace lover.
    Other Malaysians prefer to live in harmony, hands in hands.
    We should not allow the eccentricity of one idiot to destroy the lives of 27 millions peace loving Malaysians.
    Just because of one idiot, Malaysia shuld be destroyed ?
    The Malays may be forgiving, but it is not wise to always take things for granted.

    Let us stay happily AND harmoniously in a beautiful country call MALAYSIA.

    TOLERANE SHOULD BE IN THE HEART OF ALL MALAYSIANS.
    WHY ROCK THE BOAT……IT ONLY ENDANGERS OUR JOURNEY.
    MALAYSIA…MY BELOVED COUNTRY.

    1. In the early years of Maoism, Confucianism was regarded as a radical philosophy and strongly denounced by the Communists as yet another incorrigible link to the bourgeois past. During the Maoist Cultural Revolution, Confucian temples, statues and followers of Confucianism themselves took a heavy beating at the hands of rampaging communist Red Guards.

      Mao Zedong had been establishing a new political socialism for China, implementing new policy, thought and removing traces of old thought. Confucianism was “old thought” as Mao Zedong saw it. Confucianism was erdaicated during the destruction of the “four olds” in the Cultural Revolution. It was the fatal mistake of Mao Zedong because he didn’t take into consideration the religious part of Confucianism. He failed to observe the fact that Confucianism had been alive for more than two thousands years. Why has Confucianism thrived for so long a time? The answer is simple. It’s because the Chinese themselves have lived by the precepts of Confucianism. If Confucianism really suppressed and hurt the people, the Chinese would have been discarded a long time ago.

      It does not augur well for all Malaysians that Lim Kit Siang is a thoroughly committed Maoist as evidenced by his May 13th political adventurism forty years ago, and recently reinforced by his radical re-intepretation of Chin Peng’s terrorist activities in the CPM as that of an honorable freedom fighter.

  13. Pertama, Ketuanan Melayu (KM) adalah suatu yang tak boleh dihuraikan dgn ayat sepenuhnya atau di terjemah ke bahasa lain.. Maka itu salah jika KM dikritik kerana ia dikatakan ‘malay supremacy’. Cuma rakyat pribumi Tanah Melayu yang memahami dan merasai KM. Umpama orang Melayu memakai songkok ia merasai sesuatu yang pribumi; yang tidak dirasai oleh seorng bukan Melayu yang memakai songkok. KM ialah seluruh sejarah, budaya, tamadun, zat bumi ini yang ‘Melayu’. Dan, inilah segala-galanya yang dipertikai oleh bukan Melayu. Inilah dia yang dikatakan KM dicabar. Bukan Melayu mahu ‘merombak’ segala-galanya’ tak ubah seperti suatu invasive specie yang mahu menghapuskan segala yang native di habitat di sini.

    Kedua, maka itu setiap tindakan individu bukan Melayu yang rude seperti memijak gambar pemimpin Melayu, mempersenda lagu Negaraku, terbalikkan bendera Malaysia, ‘makan kangkung’, mempersoal Perkara 153 dsb, dilihat sebagai tindak-tanduk invasive specie bukan tindakan individu sbb. sudah banyak sangat pattern behaviour sebegini. Dan, tidak ada seorang pun pemimpin masyarakat bukan Melayu yang merasakan kesal tentang perbuatan sebegini atau memarahi perbuatan sebegini.

    Ketiga, oleh kerana pattern behaviuor sebeginilah PERKASA ditubuhkan dalam tahun 2006, untuk menentang kebiadaban sebegini dengan cara kasar juga. Kenapa PERKASA tidak muncul tahun 1957 sebaik sahajA Tanah Melayu merdeka ? Kerana orang Melayu bukan bangsa rasis. Walaupun kebiadaban terhadap orang Melayu keterlaluan 13 Mei tahun 1969, orang Melayu masih lagi tidak muncul dengan PERKASA. Tetapi, akhirnya, 2006 PERKASA muncul. Jangan salahkan orang Melayu lagi. PERKASA tidak muncul tanpa sebab. Tetapi, sekarang PERKASA pula yang dipersalahkan.

    Pentingnya, bukan Melayu sudah lama sepatutnya berintegrasi dengan sejarah, budaya dan peradaban orang Melayu di sini. Bukan mencabar dan mempertikai. Baru-baru ini pungutan pendapat di Britain menunjukkan 77% orang Britain tidak mahu lagi pendatang menjadi warga negara. Kenapa jadi begini ? Sebab sikap invasive specie ini.

    1. “Pentingnya, bukan Melayu sudah lama sepatutnya berintegrasi dengan sejarah, budaya dan peradaban orang Melayu di sini. ”

      Maksudnya, jangan menganuti budaya, agama masing-masing ke? Jangan ada perayaan Thaipusam seperti semalam ke?

      “Baru-baru ini pungutan pendapat di Britain menunjukkan 77% orang Britain tidak mahu lagi pendatang menjadi warga negara. Kenapa jadi begini ? Sebab sikap invasive specie ini.”

      Kalau anda bertanya dengan orang Britain, anda dapat tahu kebanyakan mereka tidak senang atau prejudis dengan imigran dari negara Islam. Orang Asia dari Hong Kong, Taiwan, China, India beragama Hindu, mereka lebih toleran.

      Habis, tentu fikiran awak akan bertukar dari ‘invasive specie’ kepada ‘I-slam-o-fo-beeah’.

      1. Pentingnya, bukan Melayu sudah lama sepatutnya berintegrasi dengan sejarah, budaya dan peradaban orang Melayu di sini. Bukan mencabar dan mempertikai”.

        Maksud saya jelas. Saya tak cakap ‘jangan menganut agama, dan budaya masing-masing. Saya tak cakap ‘asimilasi’. Saya cakap ‘integrasi’.

        Hujah saya kenapa ‘mencabar dan mempertikai – dan mempersenda’ sejarah, budaya dan peradaban Melayu’ – sesuatu yang tidak sepatutnya berlaku. Contoh, kenapa mencabar penggunaan tulisan jawi untuk nama-nama jalanraya. Kenapa persoal hakikat-hakikat dalam sejarah Malaysia sebagaimana dilihat oleh pribumi Melayu. Kenapa tidak berintegrasi dengan sejarah dan budaya Melayu maksudnya, ‘bersama-sama’ dengan sejarah dan budaya Melayu, umpamanya mendalami sejarah orang Melayu dan bukan mempertikai.

        Apabila kita telah bermastautin di bumi orang lain adalah satu kebiadapan mempertikaikan hal ehwal bangsa tempatan di bumi tersebut. Sama ada bumi tempatan itu Britain atau Perancis dsb.

        “Kalau anda bertanya dengan orang Britain, anda dapat tahu kebanyakan mereka tidak senang atau prejudis dengan imigran dari negara Islam. Orang Asia dari Hong Kong, Taiwan, China, India beragama Hindu, mereka lebih toleran.”.

        Jawapannya begini, tinjauan pendapat di Britain tidak mahu lagi menerima sebarang pendatang. Orang Britain lebih toleran dengan pendatang bukan Islam?

        Saya tanya awak pula, jika Britain menolak pendatang Islam, apakah mereka akan bersetuju di masa hadapan menerima 1 juta pendatang dari Hong Kong, Taiwan, China dan India? Sebagaimana orang Melayu dahulu besetuju menerima 1.2 juta orang Cina dan India menjadi warga negara!

        Kenapa apabila Hong Kong dikembalikan kepada China, Britain tidak mahu menerima Cina Hong Kong masuk ke Britain walhal, Cina Hong Kong adalah British subjects? Kenapa Britain tidak mahu mengambil Cina di Pulau Pinang dan Melaka menjadi rakyat Britain apabila Pulau Pinang dan Melaka dokembalikan kepada Tanah Melayu, kerana Cina Straits Settlements juga adalah British subjects?

        Yang pentingnya kita harus sedar tanggungjawab sebagai warga yang berasal daripada pendatang. Kita perlu berintegrasi dengan sejarah, budaya dan peradaban pribumi tempatan.

  14. Ketuanan Melayu=Tuan Tanah Melayu=Malay Landords? Aticle 153 is taking about ensuring BUMI and natives secure chances for education, business license etc. Nothing on Ketuanan Melayu.
    Ketuanan Melayu is political motivated to confused the MALAYS.
    A malay Driver to a Non Malay Boss in Ketuanan Melayu contexs:-

    Driver:- TUAN, kereta dah siap.
    Boss: Bagus Tuan, mari kita pergi.
    Driver: TUAN, nak ke mana
    Boss: Hari ini TUAN mau ‘tuan’ bawa TUAN ke Ampang Road untuk satu mesyuarat. Errr..Tuan dah makan?
    Driver; Belum TUAN! TUAN nak belanja ke?
    Boss: No problem Tuan, kita singgah di Mamak café TUAN belanja Tuan makan Rojak Pasembog sampai tersembog sembog. Amacam , Tuan ok tak?
    Dirver: He He, OK jugak TUAN.

    Reality of ‘Ketuanan Melayu’.? Ho heart feeling ya.

  15. kalau nak faham ketuanan melayu suruh DAP menyerang,menghina,memperendahkan,mencabar, memperlecehkan orang melayu,bahasanya,budayanya,agamanya,sultanya,organasasi kepentinganya lebih hebat lagi.

    nanti kita akan nampak tuan akan datang dan ketuananan akan dipraktikan secara total. dan kita semua akan faham dan merasainya

  16. Helen,

    TMI posted a picture of man being roughed up. Apparently, he was trying to be a hero and was defending what the PKR ADUN did.

    Or is TMI trying to instigate?

  17. jawapan atau pencerahan kepada soalan itu ada terkandung dalam perlembagaan negara malaysia. sila rujuk agar tidak keliru dan mengelirukan orang lain. tip, bagaimana cina dan india diterima menjadi rakyat malaysia. ada ‘term’ dan ‘condition’. dalam perlembagaan, tidak diberi kerakyatan ‘saja-saja’ helen.

  18. ketuanan melayu i believe is intepreted as ketuanan raja2 melayu. so as long as we have raja2 melayu, that thing is meant to stay. it is not as if every melayu is tuan to other races. gone raja2 melayu equals to gone ketuanan melayu. which is what dap is secretly working towards that direction.

  19. Ketuanan melayu. Melayu islam ketua negara. Islam mesti agama rasmi. Ini che det maksudkan. Ekonomi dah sapu, now nak sapu politik plak. And lambat laun ketuanan melayu ‘tukar’ jadi ‘ketuanan cina’ jika pkr and dapster at putrajaya.. Confirmed… For pas hmm lepas jadi mcm ni baru ahli pas sedar…

      1. Sekarang tengah nak sapu melayu keluar penang. Next nak sapu johor pulak. Projek nak sapu kedah.. Kiv

  20. Argue argue cannot menang !

    All, all of us must live in the spirit of the constitution !

    Malaysia shall be peaceful !!

    1. The Prophet s.a.w. said: “Much silence and a good disposition (akhlaq), there are no two things better than these. The strongest man is not the best wrestler; the strong man is the one who can control himself when he is angry. To overcome evil with good is a good thing, but to resist evil by evil actions is an evil thing.”

  21. Ketuanan Melayu my foot! Can’t believe these running dogs still believe in the concept of Ketuanan in this century.

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