Why would an Islamic activist like Marina hate the Islamic law, asks 11 year old

May 27, 2015 at 11:27 pm 41 comments

Interesting question.

“Marina [Mahathir] claims to be a Muslim activist fighting for Muslim rights through an NGO called Sisters in Islam,” observes Ahmad Ali Karim, who’s 11.

MarinaKarenArmstrong

This being so, why then did Marina say that she cannot live in a country where Islamic law is to be implemented?

“A Muslim should be happier when Islamic law is implemented in his or her country,” says Ahmad (pix below with PAS’s Ustaz Nasha).

Continue reading at Ahmad’s blog – ‘Is Marina Mahathir scared of hudud?

Ahmad Ali Karim Ustaz Nasha

Entry filed under: Islam. Tags: , .

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41 Comments Add your own

  • 1. tebing tinggi  |  May 28, 2015 at 12:13 am

    Semoga Marina and her alike’s, diberi pertnjuk dan hidayah ,Insaallah.

    Reply
    • 2. EVLee  |  May 28, 2015 at 3:20 am

      Aaa … kiranya dia ada pergi berjumpa dan belajar dengan ustaz Nasha ke … ada le harapan tu, kot? Tapi ketika ni(macam dalam gambar tu) nampaknya dia berguru dengan odd-stazah Karen Armstrong.

      Dalam pada masa yang sama juga, saya juga tidak boleh nafikan kekuasaan Tuhan Yg Maha Esa; dan tidak pula salah mendoakan perkara yg baik2 untuk orang lain. Mudah-mudahan …

      Reply
  • 3. penyu  |  May 28, 2015 at 3:39 am

    Can see that she is actually sakit. When married to Mat Salleh, painted the whole town with Marina Mahathir-Rousille. But, when married to a Jawa, the hyphenated is gone.

    If i were you, keep to her name Marina Mahathir-Sosrowordoyo. Mouthful isn’t it? Just like teh Sosro.

    Penyu

    Reply
  • 4. grkumar  |  May 28, 2015 at 5:20 am

    What is sad and pathetic about it is that it attracts the “intelligentsia” and the “middle class educated elite” in our parts of the world.

    So much for intelligence and education.

    People like Marina Mahathir are nothing more nothing less than armchair politicians, Chardonay lefties born with a silver spoon in their mouths preaching revolution when spelling the word in reality for them would require several tries.

    You can buy degrees and your fine silk clothes but not your pedigree. The latter you are born with.

    “You are noble even though you are not noble because you are noble.

    You are not noble even though you are noble because you are not noble”

    Reply
  • 5. daklai  |  May 28, 2015 at 8:07 am

    Hudud ala PAS no thanks

    Reply
    • 6. Keris  |  May 28, 2015 at 10:21 pm

      The photo of Ustaz Nasharuddin Mat Isa with little Ahmad Ali Karim is quite heartwarming. It is ironic that the untutored Mat Sabu has sidelined the learned Nasharuddin for the vice-president post of PAS. Is Ms. Marina Mahathir worried about Islamic law under the auspices of the “Islamists”?

      Examining the Ethics of Sharia Law: The moral responsibility of our God-given rights according to “Classical Sholarship”:


      Sheikh Hamza Yusuf:
      Objectives of the Sacred Law [Maqasid as-Shariah]

      Reply
  • 7. maae  |  May 28, 2015 at 9:47 am

    Once youre a muslim, the most important thing is to perform Solat. No solat means you’re no better than ordinary human beings and is equivelant to other living animals.

    Why is that so ?

    1. Islam starts with your heart and soul. Allah only sees your heart. Your look, your appearance, handsome, lovely or OKU, it all depends on your heart. In scientific term, we called it aura. Good or bad.is your responsibility. In Islam we simply call it NUR (cahaya) that belongs to Allah. You yourself do not have Nur. You’re just as useless as garbage when you have black heart and dead soul. Through human life, yes you are alive.

    2. Heart in Islam is the part that lays underneath your ventricles. This is the place of good and evil. This the part that you must regularly clean 24/7 , 5 times a day. Solat Maghrib, Isya, Subuh, Zohor and Asar that are “wajib”. It starts all over again, in cycle, “selagi nyawa di badan.” Thats the reason you got that heart and soul. No SOLAT means that you’re not a muslim or Islam !!!

    At this point, in stages, none other then to be a really good perfect muslim that we called “hamba Allah” Nabi Muhammad SAW was a real perfect Hamba Allah. All muslims must follow his “SUNNAH”

    3. Solat in other terminology is ZIKR. ZIKR kicks out the satan ! The ritual that cleans that particular part in your heart, where bad (satan) feels homie. We don’t need satan to be our friend ! If you dont kick out the satan, then probably, it will enjoy swimming and streaming in your blood stream, free to “murtad” the ones with no or weak “akidah and iman” totally against the “fitrah” that Allah suits it perfectly for you and your being. All true muslims believe in fitrah.

    5. If you are against Allah, you are a real satan !!! Satan exists in all nature except to disguise as being the Prophet Nabi Muhammad SAW. Allah forbids man and satan for such actions. Nabi Muhammad is fully protected and being made “maksum” – Maksum means, have no sins or no near to sins. Only and specially for Nabi Muhammad SAW.

    6. You determine yourself, either being good (normal human), being a good muslims(Islam) or being a good believer in your own choice of religion. We know that, no religion teaches you bad things ! Against all odds of your Gods, kills other human beings or even harm other man or living things. Get rid of the bad, live with the good.

    7. So, where is Marina ? We don’t judge her beings because we do believe she knows, being a muslim and non muslim. She knows her God or Gods if she believes and knows her religion, if any. We do hope that she believes in “akhirat, syurga/neraka, siksaan kubur and alam barzah !” If you believe in sickness, you must believe in pain. But where is the pain? A simple philosophy of believe.

    8. In Islam, clearly stated, to determine you’re are a muslim or not, the performing SOLAT is the definition. No solat, you are not a muslim !

    Note :- He..he.. will that answer that 11 year old boy question ? Your auntie Helen is so much better than Marina. Don’t you think so ?

    Reply
    • 8. Jeff  |  May 29, 2015 at 2:30 pm

      “Once youre a muslim, the most important thing is to perform Solat. No solat means you’re no better than ordinary human beings and is equivelant to other living animals.”

      Is that how Muslims view non Muslims, as animals?

      Reply
      • 9. grkumar  |  May 29, 2015 at 4:06 pm

        I think it is merely an extension of what Socrates believed of humans without laws. In fact he compared those who lived in societies without laws as being worse than animals.

        Christians do believe that those who are not baptised are equal to animals. Thats because their souls are not “redeemed in Christ” and therefore their entry into the Kingdom of God is not assured. The same too with Animals in their belief. But that is because they say animals “have no souls.” Perhaps it is also why they treat animals the way they do. ( a bit like how they treat non Christians.

        Reply
  • 10. shamshul anuar  |  May 28, 2015 at 1:09 pm

    Helen,

    Now that is a relevant question.

    [deleted] insinuating and implying malays can “understand” why Myanmar can inflict cruelty to Rohingyas [deleted]

    Marina, I believe is not satisfied with her own life. And takes it too UMNO, malays, melayu, islam

    Reply
    • 11. Helen Ang  |  May 28, 2015 at 1:44 pm

      Shamshul,

      Marina Mahathir is right up there with Lim Guan Eng in the NANTI AKU SAMAN ‘KO department, i.e. threatening “sue, sue, sue”.

      Isma was taken to court by her over Comango. She lost the case.

      Then Marina has also threatened to sue TV3 for describing Seksualiti Merdeka as a “free sex festival”.

      “I have been looking at your face and we know who you are,” Marina was quoted as saying. See http://www.malaysia-today.net/marina-mahathir-qcome-after-me-if-you-dareq/

      The conclusion is that with Marina – despite her own loud, self-protestations about Freedom of Expression – there’s really no room for ambiguity where it concerns any description that may cast even the slightest aspersions on her reputation.

      As such, I’ve deleted a part of your comment and copypasting below your reference to what she had written in her J-Star column … to avert Malaysia’s foremost human rights champion suing the both of us.

      Below are MM’s own words:

      “We could have dealt with the source of the problem, the way Myanmar has treated its minorities, including by simply declaring people who have lived there for hundreds of years non-citizens with merely a stroke of the pen. But then, who’s to know if some of us wouldn’t have done the same thing if we were in the same position?

      After all, we’re constantly threatening our own minorities to go back to “where they came from”. Could it be that our reluctance to deal with Myanmar is because actually, we ‘understand’?”

      Reply
      • 12. Helen Ang  |  May 28, 2015 at 1:48 pm

        re: “I have been looking at your face and we know who you are,” Marina was quoted as saying.

        Here – if the quote attributed to her is accurate and I’m not aware of any complaints that it wasn’t – it appears that she was warning (I would say intimidating) the reporter.

        When I was in NST last time, we reporters heard stories about her prima donna behaviour.

        Reply
        • 13. shamshul anuar  |  May 28, 2015 at 4:12 pm

          Helen,

          Recently, Muslim community is very upset when one Malay boy organised a session on dog. Whatever his motive was, the session ended up with Malays holding dogs, ignoring Islamic law.

          Naturally those in authority with regards to Islamic law voiced out , objecting such a session. But again a lady who has never said anything positive about Malays,islam chided the ulamak for reprimanding the organiser.

          She claimed that they try to control how Muslims should behave or how muslims should lead their life. How irrational she can be. Dogs are clearly mentioned in AlQuran as “najis” and therefore should not be touched.

          Reply
          • 14. Helen Ang  |  May 28, 2015 at 4:21 pm

            RE: “But again a lady who has never said anything positive about Malays, Islam chided the ulamak for reprimanding the organiser.”

            Oh ,) I can understand the reluctance for her to be named under the circumstances.

            re: “Dogs are clearly mentioned in Al-Quran as ‘najis’ and therefore should not be touched.”

            Can you pls give us the surah?

            Reply
            • 15. afendihamat  |  May 28, 2015 at 10:52 pm

              cik Helen,

              there’s no easy answer for that, but this might shed some light on the issue. I’m not a scholar on feqah, so I cant explain much.

              http://abidfana.com/2009/10/21/anjing-dan-permasalahan-fiqh-sekitarnya/

              this is actually quite an old issue in Kelantan.

              I’m linking to a scholarly article on the issue, more specifically on the issue of “jilatan anjing”.

              http://journalarticle.ukm.my/527/1/1.pdf

              Reply
              • 16. Helen Ang  |  May 28, 2015 at 11:09 pm

                Thanks so much for the UKM journal article! :)

                I’ve heard of the famous case but never come across a comprehensive write-up.

                I mentioned this before in an old comment @ 2013/12/16 at 10:54 am,

                “Today (confession: I used to read Astora Jabat’s Bicara Agama column in Utusan, and the other ustaz who used to appear on the same page to answer reader queries), the Malay Muslims ask a lot of nitty gritty question, e.g. Apa hukum mandulkan kucing?

                There was even an interesting debate in the Kelantan royal court (palace) between two Islamic schools of thought as to whether the Sultan’s pet dog was halal to be kept by the ruler or not. Sorry off-hand I can pinpoint the year but I have the citation somewhere. Read it in law book.”

                Reply
                • 17. Helen Ang  |  May 28, 2015 at 11:10 pm

                  re: “the other ustaz who used to appear on the same page to answer reader queries”

                  Amran Kasimin

                  Reply
            • 18. shamshul anuar  |  May 29, 2015 at 12:03 am

              Helen,

              Dogs as all of us know like to lick.

              And for Islam, dogs are cateogerized as ‘najis berat”. Muslims avoid dogs not because of stigma as claimed by the useless organizer. It is simply because it is troublesome for a Muslim to clean himself as per Islamic requirement. The word is “samak” meaning Muslims do perform cleansing method that include water mixed with soil. it is so troublesome.

              Islam have nothing against dogs. The organizer implied that Muslims have problem with dogs. what problems? we do not even go near dogs.

              Reply
              • 19. shamshul anuar  |  May 29, 2015 at 12:04 am

                helen,

                i will check on which surah that mentions of dogs and pigs

                Reply
                • 20. Helen Ang  |  May 29, 2015 at 1:49 am

                  Thanks.

                  Reply
              • 21. Helen Ang  |  May 29, 2015 at 1:50 am

                Nowadays got samak sabun?

                Reply
                • 22. shamshul anuar  |  May 29, 2015 at 8:00 am

                  Helen,

                  Samak means you have to use water and in once cleansing ritual must use a bit of soil. It is troublesome at least to me. Believe me, i was not that happy when once a dog playfully lick at my trouser. The owner of the dog apologised profusely. What can I say? I simply did the samak ritual. But if can all Muslims avoid it as it is irritating and troublesome.

                  Reply
                  • 23. Helen Ang  |  May 29, 2015 at 8:11 am

                    Sabun Taharah has got clay. So you use the sabun and rinse with water, just like we wash our hands at the sink, no?

                    Reply
                    • 24. EVLee  |  May 29, 2015 at 2:20 pm

                      Sorry for budging in … with your interest shown in this matter Boss Helen, I felt the urge to tell you these. Normally, the Muslims/Malays tend to use the words ‘samak’ and ‘sertu’ interchangeably. While both words do refer to cleaning, but they do differ as a whole.

                      > Samak – menyucikan sesuatu daripada kulit binatang(hide or skin for leather)

                      > Sertu – menyucikan sesuatu daripada najis mughalazah(najis berat)

                      I will not dwell further and hope that the above would suffice.

                    • 25. Helen Ang  |  May 29, 2015 at 2:43 pm

                      Ok, gottit, thanks. The right word is sertu then.

              • 26. Jeff  |  May 29, 2015 at 8:27 pm

                Any religion that has got something against “men’s best friend” has some serious issues. Just saying.

                Reply
                • 27. afendihamat  |  May 29, 2015 at 10:23 pm

                  LOL…what a pathetic attempt at provocation.

                  Reply
  • 28. Sder  |  May 28, 2015 at 5:39 pm

    Hi, salam everybody.

    In contrary, I believe that Marina has every right to question the implementation of Hudud. Its her right to ask as a citizen of this country.

    Saya tidak percaya kepada tohmahan dengan gelaran-gelaran “kafir, munafiq, murtad, semoga insaf, etc”. To be honest, some of her questions is valid.

    And yes, I’m the same Rushdan.

    Reply
    • 29. Helen Ang  |  May 28, 2015 at 5:53 pm

      What’s your view on hudud?

      Reply
      • 30. grkumar  |  May 28, 2015 at 6:42 pm

        Marina has rights like everyone else. But her rights do not extend to her hypocrisy and her political flatulence.

        Reply
        • 31. HH  |  May 28, 2015 at 7:33 pm

          You opined being born into affluence made someone fair game for your reverse snobbery rants or are you willing to furnish something more to back your hypocrisy claim?

          Reply
          • 32. islam1st  |  May 29, 2015 at 12:31 am

            Kau orang pun apa kurangnya? Kata dulang paku serpih nampak?

            Reply
            • 33. HH  |  May 29, 2015 at 11:58 am

              Is there a question somewhere or are you merely feeding your deprived ego by having the last say?

              Reply
              • 34. islam1st  |  May 29, 2015 at 3:03 pm

                Kenapa tak faham BAHASA ke?

                Reply
          • 35. grkumar  |  May 29, 2015 at 4:12 pm

            “You opined being born into affluence made someone fair game for your reverse snobbery rants”.

            Political flatulence and affluence are two different things altogether.

            Marina is a self made public figure propagating views that will and do effect the lives of many. That makes her fair game. She is no private shrinking violent but a public figure who draws attention to what she says.

            Whats perhaps justifiable on any criticism or attack against her in the context of what she says she stands for is that she has no valid mandate to advocate for or against government on behalf of anyone but herself.

            As an individual she has rights. Those rights of hers are no different to those of mine at a basic level to exercise either complimenting what she says, being neutral about it or attacking it when I feel it justifiable to do so.

            What has affluence got to do with the price of fish??

            Reply
  • 36. bnm  |  May 29, 2015 at 8:55 am

    Some proponents of Hudud look at the issue solely on the basis of ‘Hudud is Allah’s law and Muslims cannot reject it’. No one can deny the proposition in this ‘narrow view’.

    Hudud is a set of God sanction punishments, i.e. a subset of the bigger criminal justice system.

    The system starts from complaint/police, report, investigation, prosecution, trial and punishment (hudud is here). Hudud is not effective if the other components of the value chain is perverse/corrupted. For eg., the police selectively investigate certain cases and ignore the rest. Same example for the Attorney General that selectively prosecute certain cases and ‘No Further Action’ for the rest. Or when the judge made an impartial decision. How to implement hudud effectively? Due to its standing at the end of the value chain, the perverse/corrupted elements of the police, AG and judiciary will render Hudud ineffective.

    To all hudud proponents, if you insist to have hudud please look at the bigger picture. You need to clean up the criminal justice system. Ultimately, hudud may be sanctioned by Allah but the implementation lies with the human.

    Reply
    • 37. shamshul anuar  |  May 29, 2015 at 10:50 am

      Bnm,

      We are rejecting PAS not Hudud.

      PAS styles itself as Islam. It deems anyone who challenges him as rejecting islam. Just like Popes of medieval eras who controlled Christian kingdom by decreeing that that challenging his authority is tantamount to challenging God.

      Though I too critical of MCA or any Chinese based parties, I do understand partly they reject Hudud simply because no one among non Muslims will believe the beauty of islam if they scrtunise Mlaay community.

      Let us get real. PAS does not reach out to non muslims. Meaning i can feel it is not genuine on Hudud. If Hudud is the intention, PAS will reach out to non Muslims in no time explaining it to them.

      But i have yet to see its drsft on Hudud. cant PAS use modern gadget such as posting in in FB for all to see.

      If Hudud is the objective, PAS would have realised that it needs the support of the Malay party that has the largest block of Muslim votes:UMNO.

      But while insisting UMNO to accept Hudud, PAS leaders mock UMNO, insulted UMNO’s leaders and slanders UMNO day in day out.

      Instead of reaching to UMNO, PAS is waging war on UMNO. PAS adopts the double faced mentality when it comes to dealing with UMNO.

      At the very same time it calls UMNO to adhere to islm, PAS rejects any reconciliation with UMNO.

      That is the reason while while UMNO too has internal problem like Najib’s image and 1mdb, it still manages to get lion share of malay votes.Malays simply feel “not sure” about PAS.

      Reply
      • 38. bnm  |  May 29, 2015 at 2:08 pm

        re: We are rejecting PAS not Hudud.

        You mean the hudud version of PAS? Or the party PAS itself?

        re: If Hudud is the intention, PAS will reach out to non Muslims in no time explaining it to them.

        Explaining for what? To begin with, Hudud is not applicable on non-Muslims. Their consent is not required. Unless you want to impose hudud on them.

        BTW, Umno minister of Islamic affairs Jamil Khir already stated that Islamic laws (including hudud) must comply with Fed Con. Sounds like lack of commitment.

        Reply
        • 39. shamshul anuar  |  May 29, 2015 at 2:39 pm

          Bnm,

          Nobody is talking about non Muslim consent. Reaching non Muslim means taking out Hudud from being used by DAP to whack PAS.

          PAS often says that the concern of non Muslims is misplaced. So reach out to them. Make them realise about Hudud.

          jamil khir is just stating the obvious. It is not a matter of lack of commitment. It is reminder to PAS that the challenge to Hudud is huge.

          For a start, PAS must drop its war against UMNO.

          Reply
  • 40. bnm  |  May 29, 2015 at 11:12 pm

    re: So reach out to them. Make them realise about Hudud.

    How to objectively measure such action and the level of realisation? Afterall, the express consent of non-Muslims are not needed and hudud is not applicable to them. If the Muslims want to enforce hudud, by all means do go ahead. Each religion minds its own business.

    re: For a start, PAS must drop its war against UMNO.

    Why drop the war? Umno has been ruling Msia since independence with 2/3 majority. On certain term, BN Umno even got 90% of parliament seats. So easy to enact or amend whatever laws to enforce hudud. No such action was ever taken. In fact when Kelantan wanted to enforce hudud, Umno threaten court action. Same thing in Terengganu. That is why Pas is taking the lead to enforce hudud. Pas is quite right when it claimed to be more Islamic than Umno. In fact, Umno is the one that should drop its war against Pas. Remove all hurdles within BN parties and amend/enact whatever laws to facilitate the Pas hudud bill. Question is will Umno do so? Looking at history and the latest statement of Jamil Khir, I bet Umno will not. The biggest obstacle to enforce hudud is not the non-Muslim. It is Umno.

    Reply
  • 41. anakmelayu  |  June 6, 2015 at 8:17 am

    Sadly marina is a lost case..too liberal minded..befriending non muslims make her farther away from the true teachings of islam…she should ask any credible ustaz about islam [deleted]

    Reply

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