#paris – Perang dan pertembungan tamadun

November 16, 2015 at 8:21 am 36 comments

Mantan Menteri Penerangan Zainuddin Maidin menggesa orang Malaysia supaya membaca rencana di Utusan Malaysia hari ini bertajuk ‘Barat berjaya mendokrinkan dunia’ dan sebarkan kandungannya agar kita tidak akan mengutuk kumpulan Muslim tanpa berlapik bersabit serangan mereka di Paris tiga hari lepas.

Bekas ketua pengarang kumpulan Utusan itu merujuk sebuah laporan J-Star menyatakan apa yang berlaku di Peranchis akan meningkatkan lagi gejala Islamophobia.

Justeru Zam berpendapat bahawa Barat akan menggunakan kejadian keganasan di Paris sebagai satu alasan nanti untuk menjustifikasi tindakan membunuh lebih ramai umat Islam yang tidak berdosa.

Beliau turut memetik Perdana Menteri Singapura Lee Hsein Loong yang berpandangan bahawa pembunuhan dilakukan ke atas awam Peranchis yang tak berdosa. Namun tanya Zam, adakah pembunuhan ribuan orang di Iraq, Libya, Syria dan Myanmar itu pula ke atas orang yang berdosa?

crescentCross

Zam kata Perdana Menteri Malaysia pun perlu memberitahu Barat serangan Paris adalah sebenarnya untuk mengingatkan dosa Barat terhadap orang Islam. Beliau mengesyorkan Najib Razak untuk jangan kutuk sahaja si penyerang tanpa mengimbangi kutukannya.

Katanya lagi,

“Dalam kita mengutuk pembunuhan kejam di Paris, kita jangan lupa keganasan Barat membunuh manusia tak berdosa di Iraq dll negara utk neo-colonialism.”


“We are at war. We therefore take exceptional measures. And this war, we will win.” – Manuel Valls, Prime Minister of France


Tamadun Kristian Barat lawan dunia Islam

Alih bahasa tweet Perdana Menteri Peranchis Manuel Valls: “Kami berperang. Kami bersedia mengambil langkah-langkah yang luar biasa. Dan peperangan ini, kita akan menang.”

Presiden Peranchis Francois Hollande juga sealiran dengan perdana menterinya dari segi langkah-langkah yang kelak diambil. Hollande telah menyebut serangan tersebut ke atas Paris sebagai “aksi peperangan” (act of war).

Mengikut laporan CNN dua hari lalu, Hollande mengatakan negaranya saat ini dihadapkan dengan perang sehingga harus diambil tindakan yang tepat.

Mesti baca:

#paris – Conquistadors are terrorists too

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Alvin not dead / rumour of his assassination refuted #paris — Picture of Christian love

36 Comments Add your own

  • 1. Gene  |  November 16, 2015 at 9:44 am

    I cannot understand why some politicians justify the senseless killings in Paris as though it is just. It could have been me or you sitting in a cafe having a coffee and suddenly be put in a terrifying situation. Syria, Iraq and the countries mentioned by the Minister are in a state of war. Paris isn’t. Nor is France. This was a barbaric act. I love your column, and your views of most things especially that of the opposition, but in placing this article in your post, it strikes me that you’re supportive of the minister’s comments. IS is a real threat. To justify their killings is to support their movement. The Europeans have generously opened their borders to refugees who are predominantly Muslims. And even though most of those crossing over aren’t IS sympathisers, can you blame the western world for reacting when their kindness is repaid by such barbaric acts? Can you blame them for being suspicious of Muslims? Why do these western countries have to accommodate them and their culture when it is they who are moving into another country with a different culture?
    There is no justification to the killings. Nor is there any justification to the killings all around the world. The Muslim world and it’s leaders have to roundly condemn this act of barbarism – not try to justify it.

    Gene

    Reply
    • 2. Helen Ang  |  November 16, 2015 at 10:30 am

      re: “I cannot understand why some politicians justify the senseless killings in Paris as though it is just.”

      Zam did not justify it as “just”. He’s a journo through and through (preceding) before he’s a pollie. He was pointing out the back story. Like I said, the attacks on Paris are a form of asymmetric warfare.

      re: “It could have been me or you sitting in a cafe having a coffee and suddenly be put in a terrifying situation.”

      Likewise the locals in Syria, Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan.

      re: “Syria, Iraq and the countries mentioned by the Minister are in a state of war.”

      In part catalyzed by Western powers.

      re: “Paris isn’t. Nor is France.”

      Because they’re the strong powers. Afghanistan, for example, is a weak and poor state.

      re: “This was a barbaric act.”

      So are all the bombings by Western powers.

      re: “I love your column, and your views of most things especially that of the opposition, but in placing this article in your post, it strikes me that you’re supportive of the minister’s comments.”

      The Muslims, reflexively by religious inclination, will side with their brethren – Palestinians, Bosnians, Albanians, Rohingya, etc.

      Now, about us minority Chinese who live in a Muslim country where Islam is the religion of the Federation. The Chinese Christians are so clearly siding with the Western world. In the last couple of days, we’ve been inundated with Muslim-bashing online.

      Expressing sympathy for the Parisian victims of the attacks and their families is one thing. The Chinese reaction and partiality – manifested as hostility against Islam and Muslims – is another.

      re: “IS is a real threat.”

      The actions and intervention of the Western powers have indirectly destroyed Syria. You can cry looking at the destruction of Palmyra. It was the West that fostered the Taliban. Similarly with IS.

      re: “To justify their killings is to support their movement.”

      I repeat – Zam did not justify. He reminded Najib et al of what the West has been doing in and to the Middle East.

      re: “The Europeans have generously opened their borders to refugees who are predominantly Muslims.”

      True. But after this episode, there will be strong pressures from their far right to stop taking in refugees.

      Top three results currently on search on ‘Marine le Pen’:

      (1) ‘France must “annihilate” Islamist radicals, far-right leader Le Pen says’ (Yahoo News)
      (2) ‘Front National has chance to take centre stage after Paris attacks’ (The Guardian)
      (3) Marine le Pen surges in popularity’ – PJ Tatler

      re: “And even though most of those crossing over aren’t IS sympathisers, can you blame the western world for reacting when their kindness is repaid by such barbaric acts?”

      Water and oil don’t mix. Darul Islam and Christendom are locked in a clash of civilizations. The Chinese taking sides so overtly is bringing this clash closer to Malaysia even though many are not Christians, or are Catholics and not Bible thumpers (evangelistas).

      re: “Can you blame them for being suspicious of Muslims?”

      Nope. Not if the Muslims in the Western capitals are siding with the terrorists.

      re: “Why do these western countries have to accommodate them and their culture when it is they who are moving into another country with a different culture?”

      European communities will harden after this. That’s why the far right is rising and rising across Europe – Geert Wilders and his party, Pegida, Vlaams Belang, etc.

      ‘Ukip candidate: “Mosques should be closed after Paris attacks”‘

      re: “There is no justification to the killings.”

      It’s war.

      re: “Nor is there any justification to the killings all around the world. The Muslim world and its leaders have to roundly condemn this act of barbarism – not try to justify it.”

      Sigh. Najib already condemned. And Zam did not justify.

      Reply
      • 3. abu  |  November 16, 2015 at 11:07 am

        re: “Why do these western countries have to accommodate them and their culture when it is they who are moving into another country with a different culture?”
        Look around Malaysia and count the different cultures being inplanted by the you know who. Any comments gene?

        Reply
    • 4. I am Woman  |  November 16, 2015 at 10:34 am

      I agree with you there is no justification for killings, any killings.

      I disagree with you that Syria, Iraq and so forth are in a state of war. Those countries are under seige by the US and their allies, and just because the west has legitimised their actions by calling it a war does not make their actions any better than those of the terrorists.

      There is also no justification for war. War is just government sanctioned massive killings of the innocents. Look at their war on terror and look at the casualties. Are those killed all terrorists?

      As a famous quip goes, one man’s terrorist is another man’s freedom fighter.

      So France is going to war with the terrorists. Who and where exactly are these terrorists? Syria? Iraq? France? (One of the killers is identified as French)

      Reply
  • 5. RINA  |  November 16, 2015 at 10:41 am

    …..Syria, Iraq and the countries mentioned by the Minister are in a state of war. Paris isn’t. Nor is France…..

    Says who?
    French special forces have been tracking Islamist militants in the Sahara since 2013. France was the first European country to join the U.S. air strikes on Islamic State in Iraq last year and is the only European country to join the U.S. in air strikes in Syria.

    Sama aje, innocent civilians are murdered, in war areas or in cinemas, these are as barbaric. Don’t do onto others what you don’t want others to do onto you..

    ……Why do these western countries have to accommodate them and their culture when it is they who are moving into another country with a different culture?…

    Hang tak baca sejarah ke? Itu commonwealth countries to apasal ujud? Portugese, French, Dutch pun apa kurangnya.. Bersepah since the 1500’s. Even elephants remember inikan pula manusia.

    Apek and Aney yang daratan, ingat ya pesanan dari Gene. When in Rome do what the Romans do.

    Reply
    • 6. RINA  |  November 16, 2015 at 1:58 pm

      Prominent Nazi hunters like Simon Wiesenthal, Tuviah Friedman, Serge and Beate Klarsfeld, Ian Sayer, Yaron Svoray, Elliot Welles, and Efraim Zuroff spent years in pursuit of suspected Nazi collaborators.

      Every August 6, “A-Bomb Day”, the city of Hiroshima holds the Peace Memorial Ceremony to console the victims of the atomic bombs.

      These killings took place 70 years ago yet people esp the families of victims will continue to remember.

      People like Bush and Blair may be surrounded by bodyguards from dawn to dusk. Will their future generations get similar protections? There are millions of innocent victims murdered, raped and psychologically damaged due to ‘their weapon of mass destruction’ blunder, you think people will just let bygones be bygones?

      http://www.the-dissident.com/islam.shtml

      Reply
  • 7. AK47  |  November 16, 2015 at 12:44 pm

    Ms H. History is a cruel arbiter of the fables and foibles of Humankind. We cannot be blind to the establishment of Israel in 1949 in the face of forcing it on the Palesiinians who were residents there for 2,000 years. Nor we should be blind to the Holocaust a creation of the evil Hitler. One thing led to another which we as bystanders can only read, hear and see the horrors of how civilised Humankind treat each other in their pursuit of justice. Once blood is shed, sometimes there is no turning back as in the case of Palestine. However, we should be happy to note that Vietnam was a place where the people are willing to forget what they suffered horribly from all out War.
    And for those well-fed, well-dressed, well-ensconced tom-tom front line troops of the Singaporean Trojan Horse DAP, big daddy, the PAP Government of Singapore through the non-delusional essay with the delusional title, ‘ Singapore is not an island ‘ crafted by Bilahari Kausikan and his dysfunctional crew warns that these frivolous digits should stop their wanton acts of teasing other communities on sensitive issues like race and religion.
    Be like my nephew who went to Lao to teach them how to rear ducks or my niece who went to darkest Africa to nurse the ill and dis-advantaged. Stupid..

    Reply
    • 8. Kineas1067  |  November 16, 2015 at 3:09 pm

      Are you calling your niece and nephew “stupid”? For trying to do good?

      That says a lot about you and your mindset.

      Or, maybe, it’s your grammar that is wanting…..

      Reply
      • 9. AK47  |  November 17, 2015 at 9:54 am

        Kineas1067. I say you are smart. Very smart. You take my words out of context. Stupid. Like I say you are Kineas 67. You deserve to be reduced to only two digits ! Stupid. My old IC 671818 beats you anytime with your 1067 ! Stupid. I am surprised at you, Stupid.

        Reply
        • 10. Kineas1067  |  November 18, 2015 at 6:44 am

          What context, pray tell?

          And do post more of your rants about Singapore, please. They make for some light reading to brighten up otherwise dull days….lol.

          Btw, it takes one “stupid” person to recognise a kindred spirit (a la Anne of Green Gables), does it not?

          Reply
          • 11. islam1st  |  November 19, 2015 at 9:49 pm

            Kineas is delusional. Stupid is too kind la AK!

            Reply
            • 12. Kineas1067  |  November 20, 2015 at 7:00 am

              Ah, so – you have surfaced again?

              And your point this time is…?

              Reply
  • 13. C72  |  November 16, 2015 at 1:03 pm

    War will never solve this.
    All it does is make the arms manufacturers rich.
    And people die in cruelty all over the world for the sake of the egos of the few in power.

    Reply
  • 14. Zul85  |  November 16, 2015 at 2:35 pm

    Now with french government finally declared open war against isis just like americans did to both al qaeda and islamic countries after 911 attack few years back, are the frenchies going to believe that with their country’s firepower superiority and military alone, the isis threat will be completely neutralized and there will be no further terrorist attack at their homeland in the future? why didn’t they learn from the americans, who until now are still not able to completely win the war at both Iraq and Afghanistan despite spending trillions of dollars for military operations at both countries. Unless the deep misjudgement, misconceptions, deep hatred and prejudice between muslims and non muslims around the world are keep on going, the world will continue to see the birth of new extremist and terrorist groups other than al qaeda and isis, either born from the deep hatred or simply use other people’s hatred for their own benefits . The same thing applies to the jerusubang evangelists led by mama dapster; their filthy and dirty work of pitting down muslims and non muslims for the sake of gaining maximum votes from non muslims in order to grab political powers at both state and national level has provided a fertile breeding ground for local isis, jemaah islamiyah and few of unnamed malay muslim nationalist movements nationwide. Those evangelists should be held responsible if terrorist attacks did happen in our country as a result of their irresponsible acts towards the national harmony ( i’m not going to use word unity here as i feel there will be no such thing in this country, for the time being)

    Reply
  • 15. ahmadalikarim  |  November 16, 2015 at 3:00 pm

    Dear Aunty Helen,

    My father talked about this on TV AlHijrah this morning. It seems like this tragedy has similarity with the 9/11 tragedy.

    Anyway, as in Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan, Palestine and others, the victims are mostly innocent people who have nothing to do with the conflicts.

    Reply
  • 16. shaun  |  November 16, 2015 at 3:26 pm

    When i read a news article on 8TV Mandarin News FB, I see lot of comments (Chinese) that not only support IS and feel like very childish. Some of the comments let me just feel like they are supporting terrorist. At another hand some of them are posting profile picture that support Paris after a massacre. Even that they didnt support Najib they shouldnt be too over like that. This is really shocking.
    http://tantannews.com/%e6%96%b0%e9%97%bb%e5%a4%b4%e6%9d%a1/%e7%a4%be%e4%bc%9a%e5%8a%a8%e6%80%81/188285 -(in chinese)
    https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1144182612276046&id=147727305254920 – 8TV article and comments below (in Chinese)

    Reply
  • 17. Kineas1067  |  November 16, 2015 at 3:56 pm

    Russian President Putin on terrorists: “Whether the terrorists are forgiven or not is God’s job….my job is to send them to see God”.

    Republican US Presidential hopeful Senator Marco Rubio argued that “the US must be willing to accept civilian deaths in Syria and Iraq in order to defeat ISIS through intensified air strikes”

    He said: “It will not be deterred by targeted air strikes with zero tolerance for civilian casualties, when the terrorists have such utter disregard for innocent life.” (New York Times).

    Alexis Brezet, editor of Le Figaro, one of France’s top newspapers: “Against brutality there is only one principle: force. And against savagery, there is only one law: efficiency” (as reported in the Singapore Straits Times).

    And in the Straits Times today – “KL beefs up security ahead of Asean summit”.

    Deputy PM & Home Minister Ahmad Zahid Hamidi: “The police are not just at a stage of preparedness, but we will be increasing our manpower, especially (this) week, when Malaysia plays host to the Asean Summit. What happened in Paris could happen in any other country if preparedness is not at its optimum.”

    Defence Minister Hishamuddin Hussein said that several leaders, including himself, had received threats before the joint Asean Defence Ministers’ Meeting that was held in Malaysia in March. He said this would not scare them or halt the country’s efforts in combating terrorism in the region.

    Deputy Home Minister Nur Jazlan Mohamad warned that militant groups were trying to recruit lecturers who have knowledge in weapons and explosives, following a report that three wanted Malaysian militants were planning to form an ISIS faction in South-east Asia (as reported in the Straits Times).

    The three Malaysians were identified as former UM lecturer Mahmud Ahmad, sundry goods shop owner Mohd Najib Husen and former local council employee Muhammad Joraimee Awang Raimee (as reported in the Sunday Times yesterday).

    Terror groups in South-east Asia, as reported in the media, include Tanzim Al-Qaeda, Kumpulan Mujahidin Malaysia, Jemaah Islamiya, Darul Islam Sabah and Abu Sayyaf.

    The three wanted Malaysians are believed to be hiding in the southern Philippines. The Philippines military, according to reports, have made them top-priority targets.

    Reply
    • 18. Helen Ang  |  November 16, 2015 at 4:04 pm

      re: “Alexis Brezet, editor of Le Figaro, one of France’s top newspapers: ‘Against brutality there is only one principle: force’.”

      And what about you Kineas? You don’t believe in ‘turning the other cheek’, meh?

      Reply
      • 19. Kineas1067  |  November 17, 2015 at 9:08 am

        Really? What about the other adage that those who live by the sword die by the sword?

        Or is it scimitar in this case?

        It’s interesting that even countries where there are Muslim majorities are disavowing the actions of ISIS/Daesh.

        Are there any quarters in Malaysia that have explicitly and unequivocally expressed support for ISIS and it’s objectives?

        Are you disputing the statements made by Hishamuddin and the Malaysian Police with regard to ISIS?

        Are they also “turning the other cheek”?

        Reply
        • 20. Helen Ang  |  November 17, 2015 at 10:40 am

          re: “It’s interesting that even countries where there are Muslim majorities are disavowing the actions of ISIS/Daesh.”

          There are Muslims who believe in the conspiracy theory that ISIS is a Western (CIA) creation, and that the beheading videos are faked.

          Ismaweb, for instance, appears to suggest that the ISIS ‘caliph’/leader is in reality a Mossad agent, see http://www.ismaweb.net/2015/11/kata-pedang-serangan-paris-dicipta-untuk-tekan-islam/

          Disavowing the actions of ISIS/Daesh does not equate to condoning the West’s interference in the Middle East.

          Reply
          • 21. Kineas1067  |  November 18, 2015 at 6:53 am

            Well, you have ducked my questions. Again. Maybe it’s the Teflon coating and all.

            Ismaweb is a reliable bastion of truth and integrity, is it? I thought that they are more adept in peddling race- and religion-based views.

            And your concluding statement is a doozy! “Disavowing the actions of ISIS/Daesh” – has Isma, Perkasa, Umno, PAS etc explicitly and unequivocally done so?

            Also, how is the West’s “interference in the Middle East” congruent with Saudi Arabia and the GCC to avail themselves of the security umbrella provided by the same “crusaders” in the West?

            As too countries in Asean who may have to choose between the US and China?

            Reply
            • 22. Helen Ang  |  November 18, 2015 at 7:23 am

              re: “Well, you have ducked my questions.”

              You mean those who live by the sword had better be prepared to die by the sword? It goes for the French too. They’ve been bombing Syria. So why should anyone be surprised that the militants struck back at Paris. It’s war.

              re: “Ismaweb is a reliable bastion of truth and integrity, is it?”

              Can you prove that it isn’t? Try.

              re: “I thought that they are more adept in peddling race- and religion-based views.”

              In what way must race- and religion-based views be necessarily untruthful? Or do you have the City Harvest church and the Jerusubang set as your yardstick?

              re: “has Isma, Perkasa, Umno, PAS etc explicitly and unequivocally done so?”

              I’m not their keeper. But like I said previously, some of them buy into the conspiracy theory that ISIS is a Mossad or CIA project. As such, it’s probably a good excuse for them to skirt the issue of condemnation.

              re: “Also, how is the West’s ‘interference in the Middle East’ congruent with Saudi Arabia and the GCC to avail themselves of the security umbrella provided by the same ‘crusaders’ in the West?”

              So what? Do you have a point?

              re: “As too countries in Asean who may have to choose between the US and China?”

              Malaysia is going to sign the TPPA. That’s de facto making a choice.

              Reply
              • 23. Tebing Tinggi II  |  November 18, 2015 at 9:50 pm

                So, according to your “logic”, Malaysia has given up on RCEP, OBOR, AIIB etc because they are all “China-centric”?

                But Malaysia has a FTA with China, yes?

                And it is trying to get China to agree to have a Chinese bank do Yuan clearing in Malaysia as is already being done in Singapore.

                So, what “de facto” choice are you talking about?

                Reply
                • 24. Helen Ang  |  November 19, 2015 at 3:31 am

                  re: “So, according to your “logic”, Malaysia has given up on RCEP, OBOR, AIIB etc because they are all ‘China-centric’?”

                  Your insistence on putting words into my mouth is bordering on pathological. When did I ever bring up “RCEP, OBOR, AIIB”?

                  And from where in the thin air did you pluck the idea that I believe “Malaysia has given up on” ABC or XYZ?

                  Can you please try to argue with some modicum of intellectual honesty and integrity? Or is that too much to ask?

                  re: “what ‘de facto’ choice are you talking about?”

                  TPPA will draw us into the American sphere of influence. Uncle Sam wants to check China’s expansionist ambitions in this region.

                  TPPA is a trade pact but it has also got political dimensions, and hence the keenness of Japan (which has had many skirmishes with China on the high seas and in the air this year alone) on it.

                  Reply
                  • 25. Kineas1067  |  November 19, 2015 at 6:53 am

                    Too clever by half, Helen.

                    It is you who first used the phrase “de facto making a choice” in your post.

                    TT II asked what is this “de facto choice”.

                    Is Malaysia being forced to choose between the US and China?

                    Like it has chosen sides in “the war against terrorism”?

                    Another point – you posted about the West’s “interference in the Middle East”. That’s blatantly one-sided. Why didn’t you post about the close defence ties between the US and Saudi Arabia and the US and the other GCC countries?

                    The US has just agreed to a multi-billion arms sale to Saudi Arabia.

                    Elements of the US Sixth Fleet are based in Bahrain.

                    The US has apparently reached an agreement with Iran about the latter’s nuclear programme, much to the disquiet of Israel and Saudi Arabia.

                    Iran and Saudi Arabia are engaged in a “war of proxies” to determine who will be the dominant power in the Middle East. The Shi’a-Sunni divide accentuates this.

                    Are all of the above “interference” in the Middle East?

                    I am waiting for you to trot out your hackneyed excuse that global politics and realpolitik aren’t your areas of expertise.

                    But commenting on “political Christianity” and “Christian evangelistas” is, apparently!

                    Reply
                    • 26. Helen Ang  |  November 19, 2015 at 9:08 am

                      re: “I am waiting for you to trot out your hackneyed excuse that global politics and realpolitik aren’t your areas of expertise.”

                      No need.

                      I see that my rebuke for you to practise some intellectual honesty and not resort to putting words in other people’s mouth had touched a raw nerve, eh?

                    • 27. Kineas1067  |  November 19, 2015 at 1:34 pm

                      Not really. Just pointing out your “intellectual dishonesty” by refusing to answer the points that I made.

                      Enough said.

                    • 28. Helen Ang  |  November 19, 2015 at 1:44 pm

                      Said by an evangelista wannabe.

                    • 29. Kineas1067  |  November 19, 2015 at 3:12 pm

                      Is that the best that you can come up with?

                      Oh, how the “mighty” are fallen.

                      And being “delusional” while they are about it.

                    • 30. Helen Ang  |  November 19, 2015 at 3:14 pm

                      The longer you draw this out, the more you gonna prove your kiasu credentials.

                    • 31. Kineas1067  |  November 19, 2015 at 6:04 pm

                      “evangelista” to “kiasu”? What next? It looks like I am hitting some pretty sensitive nerves out there, seeing as how they prefer to duck and evade instead of giving straightforward unambiguous answers.

                      But that is par for the course for these parvenu bloggers, who when put on the spot, attempt to wiggle their way out.

                    • 32. Helen Ang  |  November 19, 2015 at 6:15 pm

                      evangelista = sneaky

                      kiasu = you

  • 33. Orang Perlis  |  November 17, 2015 at 9:57 am

    At the end of the day, we are still chummy with America.

    So at the end of the day, nothing much will change the fate of those suffering in Syria, Iraq , Lebanon, Nigeria, Paris etc…

    betul tak?

    As much as the west is to be blamed by all this , remember this conflict also involves Shia vs Sunni, in essence, both are Muslims.

    Reply
  • 34. islam1st  |  November 19, 2015 at 9:51 pm

    ‘Ismaweb is a reliable bastion of truth and integrity, is it?’

    Kalau tak, siapa? YOU is it?

    Reply
    • 35. Kineas1067  |  November 20, 2015 at 7:03 am

      Maybe.

      Are you? Or Helen?

      Hahaha….

      Reply
      • 36. islam1st  |  November 20, 2015 at 9:27 am

        Take the advice, stop being delusional!

        Reply

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